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Is tired of NA
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Discussion Starter #1
Well before i start with the topic of this thread i must first say how nervous i am to click this submit button. I feel like i should search the forum more but ive looped around to the same threads time and time again and nothing quite desribes, or fixes, what i have going on.


So i managed to destroy the crank in my 94SI so i opted for the JDM h22 swap of course. I was equipped with only a general knowledge of engines so it was a rather rough road, even for the simplest of swaps... But I learned a lot and managed to get it fired up...


Then the problems began, although i expected this.


The CEL has been on since the initial start and the car was running really rough... Through minor tinkering (timing, plugs, vacuum lines) the car became more stable. But i can't seem to figure out what is going on with it right at this moment.. I am able to drive the car without the danger of it breaking down on me completely but it is acting awful weird.

The car has pretty major hesitation throughout the RPM range prior to 4-4500 and still more hesistation past this point unless you are at WOT. At WOT the car lugs around til it hits 4grand and which point it seems to "punch" through a sort of barrier as it regains some of its power. Even if you are around the 5500 mark when you go WOT it has to overcome this barrier... Vtec never engages and if it is supposed to make 200hp to the crank, its making about 55...


The idle was sporadic (rising and falling) and was making it a pain in the neck to drive so i unhooked the TPS and it cleared up the sporadic idle. That of course caused the car to now idle at 1,500 (best instance) and sometimes during warm-up it will idle as high as 3500... I believe that the cackle/backfire when coasting in gear is a result of the TPS being unhooked.



When the car is cold, it runs better, no hesitation, feels like H23 power, but as soon as it warms up the hesitation starts and it literally takes 15 seconds to get to 65-70... and thats beatin on it.



I ran a diagnostic on the car and it came back with o2 sensor, fuel supply system, the vtec solenoid code, ignition output signal code, the TPS of course, and the MAP code...



I replaced the o2 sensor, hooked the TPS back up, respliced the vtec wire to make sure it had a good connection, and wired up the MAP sensor that comes mounted on the top of the JDM throttle body.


I went through the procedure of resetting the ECU but im not sure if it worked because i didnt manage to eliminate one singal code. And yes i do have the p13 ECU. its a virgin.


With the TPS hooked up and after an ECU reset, the car literally falls on its face under any throttle for a few miles. I guess until the ECU learns how to remedy this? However without the TPS hooked up and after an ECU reset, the car runs exactly as it did before. (hesitation, blah blah)


I've read all the posts that describe bits and pieces of these symptoms and many of them say that the 6800redline and hesitation is due to "limp" mode... Well either i cant get the car out of limp mode or its not in limp mode.


I was told by a friend that he didnt think Vtec would engage and that the redline would be 6800 if all the temp sensors weren't working at the same time. I took the upper coolant housing off the h23 (one with the sensor in it) and put it on the H22 and hooked it up... still no fix. Also i was told that if the car couldnt register that it was in gear or moving that it would cause these symptoms... The speedo works and the temp gauge works as well. (normal temp)


I'm sorry for the lengthy post. I'm just trying to be thorough so that you guys dont have to waste your time asking for additional information, although im sure that i have left some parts out. I sure hope no one tries to kick my teeth in for posting this new thread when so many are out there already with much of the same info. I want to ask questions on some of them but i'd rather risk pissing someone off with this post rather than resurrect a dead thread.


Any help and of you could provide would be greatly appreciated. I love to tinker on the car but i'm beginning to think its a little over my head. Thanks again.

-Jarrod
 

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Is tired of NA
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18 Posts
Discussion Starter #2
Another tid bit about the cackle...


It only cackles when my foot is completely off the pedal, just the slightest resting of my foot on it causes it to coast normally.. Also, if i run it up to 4500 or so and start to coast in that same gear, it usually doesnt cackle and it will coast all the way to a stop without making any noise... However if it isnt making any noise through the problem area (2500-4000) just the slightest tap of the throttle and releasing again will spark the cackle once again... It sounds like a big block chevy with open headers....
 

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woop woop!
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3,697 Posts
holy ****, I thought DP was back for a second.
 

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Is tired of NA
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18 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
When the car first starts (independant of warm or cold) the CEL isnt on (4-5seconds)... The car has great throttle response.. when the CEL comes on the throttle response Halves
 

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Is tired of NA
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18 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
Then you're throwing one or more codes. Take it to Autozone or a similar auto parts store and use their code reader. That'll help you nail down what the problem is.
Well the thing is, i know what codes im spitting out, but ive tried to fix a few of them with known good parts... codes just keep coming back even after supposedly resetting the ECU... I'm waiting on a distributor to deliver itself to my house this weekend (i believe mine was frapping out on the previous motor)
 

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What codes is it throwing? Did you properly adjust the TPS?
 

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Is tired of NA
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Discussion Starter #10
What codes is it throwing? Did you properly adjust the TPS?
It's throwing the same codes as before (the ones listed in my original post) even after swapping out with known good parts. I dont think i know how to adjust the TPS, unless you are referring to the screw behind the little plate on the back side of the TB
 

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lol sorry reading fail. I saw the long post and I just just skipped to the reply box :laugh:

The TPS is on the backside of the throttle body. If its not properly adjusted, the fuel mixture can be WAY off. If you search around, you'll find the procedure for adjusting it.

What distributor were you running? Did you swap for a USDM external coil or did you wire it up with the internal coil?
 

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Is tired of NA
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18 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
lol sorry reading fail. I saw the long post and I just just skipped to the reply box :laugh:

The TPS is on the backside of the throttle body. If its not properly adjusted, the fuel mixture can be WAY off. If you search around, you'll find the procedure for adjusting it.

What distributor were you running? Did you swap for a USDM external coil or did you wire it up with the internal coil?
Yea i checked the screw, i dont know if "tight" is an adjustment but it definately wasnt spinning around in there. External coil usdm. on the h23 i was getting power loss when under 2500 rpm, still ran the same time at the track though so it didnt transfer into power loss above that range. i blamed the distributor but never had a chance to troubleshoot as the motor decided to give way before i could get around to it
 

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Is tired of NA
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18 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
Ah crap i keep thinking of the Idle screw embedded in the TB.... My apologies G_Loc. No i havent tried adjusting the TPS... wierd thing is, the bouncy idle didnt occur until i put about 100-200 miles on the car. Reason i knew to unhook the TPS was because my buddy who owns a 93 vtec had the bouncy idle syndrome. but thats All he has so he hasn't been much help to me. But sure i could try and adjust it, should it be a running adjustment, with the car idling?
 

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Nope. Car off, but with key in the ignition. You will need a multimeter.

Here you go: http://www.preludeonline.com/f28/how-replace-adjust-throttle-position-sensor-tps-236073/

Before adjusting it, check the voltages as is, so you can see how far off it may be. Also check for dead spots by slowly opening and closing the throttle by hand. The voltage readout should not jump or drop dramatically (depending if you are opening the throttle or closing it)
 

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Is tired of NA
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Discussion Starter #16
Well thats pretty neat. I don't think i have access to a multimeter down here (i work in KY 5 days a week), but ill try to get advance to lend me one for a few minutes... Thanks for that information G Loc



Before i call it a night, Any idea why replacing the o2 and switching to the TB MAP didnt clear up the code they triggered, even after an ECU reset? And the ignition output signal, code 15, that pretty much has to be distributor/coil related right?
 

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Did any wire harnesses get smashed or frayed during the swap?

As for the ignition code... Not sure about that one. I can check my Helms tomorrow

I noticed you said something about the MAP being on the throttle body. The MAP sensor is actually on the firewall. What part are you referring to?

Pull up a parts diagram from Majestic Honda - The Internet's #1 Honda Automotive Parts Store and tell us what numbers you are referring to
 

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Is tired of NA
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Discussion Starter #18
Yea sorry about that, I'll be more specific. On the JDM vtecs the TB comes with a MAP resting directly on top of it, and i guess its pretty common to switch from the firewall to the one on the TB and eliminate the need for the vacuum line. When i plug back in to the MAP on the firewall (vacuum line hooked up as well) the car will barely idle (200-400 rpm). The wire harness is in good shape and i tested any splicing done to make sure i was getting a good connection through all the plugs.


I really need to pick up a helms...

As other posts with symptoms close to these a similarity between them is the Fuel supply system code 43, It seems to cause symptoms similar to what the Limp mode does
 

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Is tired of NA
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Discussion Starter #19
So I didn't get off work in time today to have any light left to tinker around. I'll be home tomorrow though and I'm gonna grab a multimeter on the way.. Seems that there isn't any work for me next week so I should have PLENTY of time to see whats going on. Also got a MSD 6a, cap, rotor, wires, and coil in the mail today. We'll see where that takes me.

Just wanted to say thanks for the idea, I'll give it a shot and report back. If anyone has any other suggestions just post it of course =)

Have a good one
 
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