ding!
Dr. James and other Turbo-internal knowledgeble people...
Okay, now that I got the basic turbo kit together with a few odds and ends, let's talk about the next step....internals.
It seems that 9:1 is the way everyone is going for pistons. My question is...
What brand is better- JE or Arias(sp?)
Also, I noticed on JE's website that there are a bunch of different shapes and things that you can get done to the piston(like gas ports, hollowed-dish-surface-like treatment, etc). What is good for turbo?
Also, what piston seals/rings should I get?
RODS- Crower the way to go here, or is there better ones? Also, will they both work with either JE or Arias, and are there any different things to look/match up when getting them.
Re-Sleaving walls- I take it that there are no parts to order for this, rather it is a process that a machine shop would do for about $400 total? Anything else to know about concerning this process?
Anything else critical to do while the head is off and the internals are getting a changing(like a better head gasket-now would be a good time to swap them).
Thanks(BTW, all ?'s relate to 5th gen lude only)
It seems that 9:1 is the way everyone is going for pistons. My question is...
What brand is better- JE or Arias(sp?)
Also, I noticed on JE's website that there are a bunch of different shapes and things that you can get done to the piston(like gas ports, hollowed-dish-surface-like treatment, etc). What is good for turbo?
Also, what piston seals/rings should I get?
RODS- Crower the way to go here, or is there better ones? Also, will they both work with either JE or Arias, and are there any different things to look/match up when getting them.
Re-Sleaving walls- I take it that there are no parts to order for this, rather it is a process that a machine shop would do for about $400 total? Anything else to know about concerning this process?
Anything else critical to do while the head is off and the internals are getting a changing(like a better head gasket-now would be a good time to swap them).
Thanks(BTW, all ?'s relate to 5th gen lude only)
1 - 20 of 22 Posts
good luck!<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Spocko:
Okay, now that I got the basic turbo kit together with a few odds and ends, let's talk about the next step....internals.
ok...
It seems that 9:1 is the way everyone is going for pistons. My question is...
What brand is better- JE or Arias(sp?)
I prefer JE, no specific reason, my local speedshop Jotech Motorsports runs em in all their vehicles.
Also, I noticed on JE's website that there are a bunch of different shapes and things that you can get done to the piston(like gas ports, hollowed-dish-surface-like treatment, etc). What is good for turbo?
dont know, try calling JOtech 972-278-9744, talk to Tony, tell em Mike sent you
Also, what piston seals/rings should I get?
typically, seals and rings should come with the piston set.
RODS- Crower the way to go here, or is there better ones? Also, will they both work with either JE or Arias, and are there any different things to look/match up when getting them.
for sure, crower, otherwise, try calling IMPOPERFORMANCE, they make custom titanium connecting rods. Its definitely a pretty penny however.
Re-Sleaving walls- I take it that there are no parts to order for this, rather it is a process that a machine shop would do for about $400 total? Anything else to know about concerning this process?
damn boss, how many pounds of boost are you planning to run. You are definitely taking the appropriate steps to re-inforce your motor. I never upgraded my internals to my f22 accord. I figured, any motor is liable to pop. especially if you are planning to run 1.0 Bar for the street.
Anything else critical to do while the head is off and the internals are getting a changing(like a better head gasket-now would be a good time to swap them).
I would strongly suggest a fuel management system like Haltech. Im assuming you are wanting to run at least 1.0 BAR for the street. BTW, what kind of wastegate are you running? Im running Turbonetics Deltagate wAstegate, THEY SUCK over 10psi. Get a TIAL. They hold high boost real well...hope this information helps you out.
Thanks(BTW, all ?'s relate to 5th gen lude only)</font>
helpin you get back TTT, might as well because i'm jealous as ****!! Sorry i can't help you with any questions but i'm dying to learn the answers, I WILL BE TURBOCHARGED...i hope!
When you order your pistons make sure to ask them for the rings and pin as well.
The face of the dish is usually dependent on the compression. A dish (concave) is a low compression piston, flat is mediocre, and a dome piston gets into high compression. Gas porting should be left for drag only because it increases wear.
Endyn H22a pistons are supposed to be out soon; a week or two. I'll be picking up a set of these. Race Engineering www.raceng.com lists Eagle rods as available for the H22a. I'd suggest them, but Crower is just fine.
For internals you want to get the pistons, rods, and crank balanced before they're put in. That'll add to your rebuild cost.
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DirtyLude
My Car
Toronto Prelude Club
www.hondaprelude.to
The face of the dish is usually dependent on the compression. A dish (concave) is a low compression piston, flat is mediocre, and a dome piston gets into high compression. Gas porting should be left for drag only because it increases wear.
Endyn H22a pistons are supposed to be out soon; a week or two. I'll be picking up a set of these. Race Engineering www.raceng.com lists Eagle rods as available for the H22a. I'd suggest them, but Crower is just fine.
For internals you want to get the pistons, rods, and crank balanced before they're put in. That'll add to your rebuild cost.
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DirtyLude
My Car
Toronto Prelude Club
www.hondaprelude.to
Migs-
14 psi for the street?? That's some balls.
14 psi for the street?? That's some balls.
Oh yeah, you might want to send your pistons to be coated by Swain. I'll be sending my pistons out for the gold coat and the skirt coating. Ryan Earl doesn't have the pictures up of his coated pistons anymore, but the Swain webpage is http://www.swaintech.com
The cost is $180.00 for the pistons.
Keep us up to date on your plans.
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DirtyLude
My Car
Toronto Prelude Club
www.hondaprelude.to
The cost is $180.00 for the pistons.
Keep us up to date on your plans.
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DirtyLude
My Car
Toronto Prelude Club
www.hondaprelude.to
don't forget to upgrade your oil pump and water pump. some shops like the one i goto can make them flow more for fi motors.
as for the sleeving, you definitely need to sleeve the h22a block. the cylinder walls are made of a nickel or softer material then the b series motors. they're very hard to hone out properly for even standard sized pistons.
crower might be on back order so make sure to order them right away. as for the pistons, watch the coating from swain. there are tons of different views on this. people who coat internal parts usually build their motors way more then once. the reason is if the coating cracks, tremendous heat builds in that one area. i've seen two motors where the coating cracked and the motors just totally went. one was a valve and the other was a piston. but the cracking happens by chance.
and like whoever said, definitely go with an engine management system. obd2 cars are very hard to tune turbo systems. i've seen so many triger engine codes even running upto 5 check valves.
the 9:1 compression is definitely the way to go. you might also want to upgrade the valvetrain in the head. but the engine management system is very key.
get the engine management system that the shop you're familiar with uses. haltechs are sweet, but if you can't find anyone to tune them, it's worthless. and most shops can't. you might also want to look into a cheaper dfi system, speed pro, etc.
as for the sleeving, you definitely need to sleeve the h22a block. the cylinder walls are made of a nickel or softer material then the b series motors. they're very hard to hone out properly for even standard sized pistons.
crower might be on back order so make sure to order them right away. as for the pistons, watch the coating from swain. there are tons of different views on this. people who coat internal parts usually build their motors way more then once. the reason is if the coating cracks, tremendous heat builds in that one area. i've seen two motors where the coating cracked and the motors just totally went. one was a valve and the other was a piston. but the cracking happens by chance.
and like whoever said, definitely go with an engine management system. obd2 cars are very hard to tune turbo systems. i've seen so many triger engine codes even running upto 5 check valves.
the 9:1 compression is definitely the way to go. you might also want to upgrade the valvetrain in the head. but the engine management system is very key.
get the engine management system that the shop you're familiar with uses. haltechs are sweet, but if you can't find anyone to tune them, it's worthless. and most shops can't. you might also want to look into a cheaper dfi system, speed pro, etc.
I've read a few places where guys who used the swain coatings and later tore everything down, found that they had cracked and flaked on the surface... Has anyone else heard this or seen it first hand?
I know T.O.O. was pretty down on their coatings too... May have been where I first heard about it.
I know T.O.O. was pretty down on their coatings too... May have been where I first heard about it.
Dirtylude- could you repost the site with the eagle rods, it didnt work.
Also - I think - but don't quote me on this, Eagle doesn't make rods for 5th gen - only h22a1 4th gen...? The guys at race engineering would know. www.raceeng.com
[This message has been edited by IXLR8 (edited March 28, 2001).]
[This message has been edited by IXLR8 (edited March 28, 2001).]
I just got off the phone with Race Engineering, they said that Eagle is in the middle of making rods for the h22a, but they are not out yet.
I missed the middle 'e'. The Eagle rods are listed on their sport compact catalog .pdf file.
http://www.raceeng.com/importengine-main.asp
H22a1 and H22a4 rods are exactly the same. I'd ask Race Engineering about the availability because I e-mailed Eagle themselves and the guy who replied wasn't even sure if they made H22a rods at all. I'd order from Race Engineering myself, but they don't take Amex. Damn them!
That worries me about the coatings cracking. I've never heard of this before. If anyone has any more information, please post it. Was it Swain coatings that cracked? I know there are a few companies out there that do ceramic coats.
------------------
DirtyLude
My Car
Toronto Prelude Club
www.hondaprelude.to
http://www.raceeng.com/importengine-main.asp
H22a1 and H22a4 rods are exactly the same. I'd ask Race Engineering about the availability because I e-mailed Eagle themselves and the guy who replied wasn't even sure if they made H22a rods at all. I'd order from Race Engineering myself, but they don't take Amex. Damn them!
That worries me about the coatings cracking. I've never heard of this before. If anyone has any more information, please post it. Was it Swain coatings that cracked? I know there are a few companies out there that do ceramic coats.
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DirtyLude
My Car
Toronto Prelude Club
www.hondaprelude.to
Geez, you people reply quicker than I can post.
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DirtyLude
My Car
Toronto Prelude Club
www.hondaprelude.to
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DirtyLude
My Car
Toronto Prelude Club
www.hondaprelude.to
i think there were some pictures of the swain coatings that cracked on either honda-tech / hostboards or clubsi.com . it was a long time ago, but i do remember the person pulling their motor apart and seeing that the coatings were cracked and showed hot spots where it cracked.
Tim
Tim
I guess either race engineering doesnt know what they are talking about or they printed the sport compact catalog prematurly because when i called he told me they were on a boat somewhere between here and china. so i guess that means you can get them, but it might take a while.
if you want, you can get the endyn rods too. they are basically eagle rods modified for TOO. as for sleeving, the sleeves is something to be purchased, usually by the shop that will then "install" the sleeves for you and hone and deck them for you. like they said, it is the machine work that makes up the bulk of the cost
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98 Turbo Prelude
www.151boost.com
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98 Turbo Prelude
www.151boost.com
Balls? That would be just right for the setup hes going for. resleeve, pistons? For sure......<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Aaron97SH:
Migs-
14 psi for the street?? That's some balls.</font>
...if the block and internals was stock, yeah, thats mad balls! BALLS OF STEEL!
DirtyLude: try doing a search for Swain on Endyne's board. I'm pretty sure that's one of the places I saw that.
I did the search and all I got was this 'Friend of a friend told me...' message:
http://ferrari.colowatch.com/php/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Board=ENDYN_Tech&Number=15470
I also did a search on some search engines for anything on Swian cracking or flaking or anything like that. All I found were Swain praise articles. I'd write Swain themselves, but we're all pretty certain of the answer we'd get from them. They also say in their own literature that it bonds directly to the molecular structure of the metal and will not crack or flake.
I'm still going to get my pistons done unless I can find something more substantial. If anyone finds anything, please post.
Well, it looks like I'll be getting Crower rods unless Eagle puts out the H22a rods in the next month and a half or so. My build up is planned for June or July.
------------------
DirtyLude
My Car
Toronto Prelude Club
www.hondaprelude.to
http://ferrari.colowatch.com/php/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Board=ENDYN_Tech&Number=15470
I also did a search on some search engines for anything on Swian cracking or flaking or anything like that. All I found were Swain praise articles. I'd write Swain themselves, but we're all pretty certain of the answer we'd get from them. They also say in their own literature that it bonds directly to the molecular structure of the metal and will not crack or flake.
I'm still going to get my pistons done unless I can find something more substantial. If anyone finds anything, please post.
Well, it looks like I'll be getting Crower rods unless Eagle puts out the H22a rods in the next month and a half or so. My build up is planned for June or July.
------------------
DirtyLude
My Car
Toronto Prelude Club
www.hondaprelude.to
1 - 20 of 22 Posts
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