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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Just wondering, my engine mods are:
AEM CAI
DC SS Headers
Tanabe G Power
AEM pulley
AEM Cam gears
Type S cams
Magnecor wires
Apexi VAFC.
I'd guess maybe about 240???

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That's a nice prelude-I'd pay fifty dollars for one!
http://www.hondaprelude.com/setups/setupsdsply.asp?id=10306
 
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Well, what did you dyno at the wheels?

The only way to really know what kind of power you're making is to put it on an engine dyno.

Have you done a valve adjustment since you did the Type S cams?

Also, 240 is quite opimistic, I believe.

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Billy
North Texas Prelude Owners Group
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by 71dsp:
Well, what did you dyno at the wheels?

The only way to really know what kind of power you're making is to put it on an engine dyno.

Have you done a valve adjustment since you did the Type S cams?

Also, 240 is quite opimistic, I believe.
</font>
178.3 @ wheels w/ 141 torque.
Yes, valves were adjusted upon Cam installation.
Thanks for the response.


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That's a nice prelude-I'd pay fifty dollars for one!
http://www.hondaprelude.com/setups/setupsdsply.asp?id=10306
 
G

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No, I mean, since the install have you done a valve adjustment? Are you running stock valve springs? If so, pull the valve cover and check your cams.

If you assume a 20% loss (yeah, I know it's more complicated than a just a set percentage, but it's a rule of thumb), then 178 whp would be 214 crank hp.

Even if you assume that the power loss is constant (say 45 hp, since most 5Gens dyno stock a little above 155 hp, but let's say 45 hp for argument's sake), then 178whp would be 223 crank hp, so I bet you're somewhere in between 210 and 225 crank hp.

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Billy
North Texas Prelude Owners Group
www.ntpog.org
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by 71dsp:
No, I mean, since the install have you done a valve adjustment? Are you running stock valve springs? If so, pull the valve cover and check your cams.

If you assume a 20% loss (yeah, I know it's more complicated than a just a set percentage, but it's a rule of thumb), then 178 whp would be 214 crank hp.

Even if you assume that the power loss is constant (say 45 hp, since most 5Gens dyno stock a little above 155 hp, but let's say 45 hp for argument's sake), then 178whp would be 223 crank hp, so I bet you're somewhere in between 210 and 225 crank hp.
</font>

No I've only had the Type-S cams for about a month. I'm using stock valvetrain. I will upgrade the valvetrain when I go turbo. Check my cams for what?


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That's a nice prelude-I'd pay fifty dollars for one!
http://www.hondaprelude.com/setups/setupsdsply.asp?id=10306
 
G

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Check for abnormal wear. Larry measured the stock valve springs and found that they will coil bind when the Type S cams are at full lift.

I suggest you pull the valve cover, and look at the VTEC lobes. Turn the engine to where some of the VTEC lobes (intake or exhaust) are pointing straight up. Look at them. If they look scored, run your finger nail down them and see if the scoring is bad enough to catch your finger nail.

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Billy
North Texas Prelude Owners Group
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
The cams were used.out of another 5th gen (not a type S). They've got about 10K on them and NO abnormal wear. I had them inspected very carefully before I had them installed.
Definitly no scoring.

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That's a nice prelude-I'd pay fifty dollars for one!
http://www.hondaprelude.com/setups/setupsdsply.asp?id=10306
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
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Are you not understanding what I am saying. Larry told me that the stock valve springs will coil bind when the VTEC lobe hits max lift. This means that the cams will eat the rockers, if this occurs.

So, I am just trying to say that there might be a chance that you might have some damage. I am curious, more than anything, so see if everything is good to go in your engine.

I had a set of Type S cams with Web Cam springs and retainers ruin my valve rockers, and we are still not sure what caused it. I know of one person who installed Type S cams with stock valve springs (with Portflow inners), and his rockers were ruined as well. That's when Larry found that the stock valve springs were binding at max lift.

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Billy
North Texas Prelude Owners Group
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by 99Prelude_LC:
maybe they aren't type S cams
i've seen dyno numbers with the mods you have w/ stock cams hehe
</font>
Horse power factors in weight right?
I have a heavy system- I know I'd be alot faster w/o it, but i gotta have my music.
I KNOW they are S cams, since they're used I had them compared w/ my VTEC cams on a micrometer just to make sure they were not being sold to me as S Cams, but really stock.


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That's a nice prelude-I'd pay fifty dollars for one!
http://www.hondaprelude.com/setups/setupsdsply.asp?id=10306

[This message has been edited by coil222 (edited April 14, 2001).]
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by 71dsp:
Are you not understanding what I am saying. Larry told me that the stock valve springs will coil bind when the VTEC lobe hits max lift. This means that the cams will eat the rockers, if this occurs.

So, I am just trying to say that there might be a chance that you might have some damage. I am curious, more than anything, so see if everything is good to go in your engine.

I had a set of Type S cams with Web Cam springs and retainers ruin my valve rockers, and we are still not sure what caused it. I know of one person who installed Type S cams with stock valve springs (with Portflow inners), and his rockers were ruined as well. That's when Larry found that the stock valve springs were binding at max lift.
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Yes, I understand, but I want to give them more time. I'll be gone for 2 weeks (going to Hawaii) in May, getting a clutch/flywheel/LSD/ and probably Tein HAs in the meantime. Might have the cams looked at then.
When you and your buddy had your rockers messed up by the cams, how long after the install was it, what kinda symptoms did you pick up, and how much $$ to get it behind you? I've heard alot of bad and alot of good about the S-Cams, I'd have gotten Crower if I had known they were so close to coming out, I still might be getting crower stage 1 or 2, my tuner is getting all 3 stages to test--he got a special Deal from Crower.


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That's a nice prelude-I'd pay fifty dollars for one!
http://www.hondaprelude.com/setups/setupsdsply.asp?id=10306
 
G

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by coil222:
When you and your buddy had your rockers messed up by the cams, how long after the install was it, what kinda symptoms did you pick up, and how much $$ to get it behind you? I've heard alot of bad and alot of good about the S-Cams, I'd have gotten Crower if I had known they were so close to coming out, I still might be getting crower stage 1 or 2, my tuner is getting all 3 stages to test--he got a special Deal from Crower.
</font>
I am not sure how long he had them on, but I had them on for about 1k miles. New valve rockers are $700 from www.hparts.com.

I haven't reassembled my engine yet, as there is a lot more stuff being done to it, but that was the main reason for the tear down.

HP has nothing to do with weight (HP rating for an engine, at least). HP = torque * rpm / 5252, i.e. hp is function of torque at a given RPM. If you look at a graph, the torque curve and hp curve intersect at 5252 RPMs.

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Billy
North Texas Prelude Owners Group
www.ntpog.org
 

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if the lobes of some cams had some dark discoloration on them... like they were coat'd with something... what is that?

[This message has been edited by Luder-xhpx (edited April 14, 2001).]
 
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Luder-xhpx:
if the lobes of some cams had some dark discoloration on them... like they were coat'd with something... what's is that?</font>
Honda cams have a dark bluish colored coating on them. After a little use, the bluish coating wears off on the cam lobes. It's normal.

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Billy
North Texas Prelude Owners Group
www.ntpog.org
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
at what RPM are the cams @ full lift.
(not too technical so please exucse me if this is a dumb question).If I do not redline the car is there less likelyhood of this happening?
Typically I rev to 5-7k, and I shift @ 7400 during races, never redlilne it.

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That's a nice prelude-I'd pay fifty dollars for one!
http://www.hondaprelude.com/setups/setupsdsply.asp?id=10306
 

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Originally posted by 71dsp:
Honda cams have a dark bluish colored coating on them. After a little use, the bluish coating wears off on the cam lobes. It's normal.

That's what I was thinking, but just wanted to check, thanx for the reply. Isn't that color from a hardening process the cams go through or something?
 
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by coil222:
at what RPM are the cams @ full lift.
(not too technical so please exucse me if this is a dumb question).If I do not redline the car is there less likelyhood of this happening?
Typically I rev to 5-7k, and I shift @ 7400 during races, never redlilne it.
</font>
A single VTEC lobe hits full lift once for every 2 complete rotations of the crank, when in VTEC mode. So, it's independent of RPM. If you are in VTEC, then then each valve hits max lift once for each 2 rotations of the crank. Make sense?

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Billy
North Texas Prelude Owners Group
www.ntpog.org
 
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