Hello,
(Please only contribute if you were actually interested in this topic) for those who were interested in that old topic and never got around to updating us on their project: I got around to continuing my research on the idea and it turns out some of the eclipse guys have done this without too much drama. I'll but doing this sooner than later, but if people want to try this before I do please do. http://www.angelfire.com/fl5/import/indigloneedles.html
and http://www.angelfire.com/fl5/import/console.html
Why do this? Well to people who like everything stock, you may not care, when you get an after market radio VAFC or anything interior it doesn't look very OEM. For most that's the point, but I like everthing to be unified.
This one was about the indiglo needle idea what do you think of these? I actually think that kit was similar to the first linked setup, but if you avoid the pitfalls that trial & error will give you it still may work If you like LED tech, then check this out http://www.varad.com/
If anyone remembers any other contributions please add it here.
Thanks guys, I don't have a tri-pod so I'm going to have to figure out how to take a night picture without moving while the shutter's open (and of course do this project).
Originally posted by checkmate58 I donate this picture of my dash:
--Sam
Thanks sam. I searched but didn't find where you describe what's involved with your dash setup.
Update: I'm going to Frye's to pick up some LEDs and resistors. As I understand it you just plug in the voltage and amps of you LED into Ohm's Law and get the resistor specs from the answer. I need to shop for a tipical LED first before I can get the exact resistor like they show on the 1st/2nd link above.
this hurts my business but i just thougt i let you guys know a lil something....the prelude needles setup has only 2 holes to let light go thru from the back to light up its needles.....if you only use the 2 leds like the setup told you too...then as you climb up to speedo of 80 or whenever you go where the needles optics are not over the led...then the needle will not receive light and will go dim......also good luck with taking out the needles as to you still can screw up the servo motor but dislodging the axis need itself.....
Honda quoted me at 721 for a new gauge cluster if you break yours.....i rather let someone do it and collect up on their warentee *hint hint* Lates
Heh, nice to see you found my old post about this issue. It's been nearly 3 months since I removed my blue needle kit, honestly they weren't all too impressive and got annoying after a while. So I repainted my needles to a bright red and I like how it looks now, might even use a red led bulb to help brighten it up. My tach and speedometer are recalibrated correctly and I'm pretty happy about that, fuel and oil temp are still stuck tho
I went to Fry's yesterday and picked up some blue (actually on the purple side) LED's (#B4304H6-1 .20A) that seem comparable to Radio Shack's brightest off the shelf LED (#276-316). Fry's LEDs come with little plastic sleeve/holders which might be usefull at some point. I didn't find any resistors there in the 600 Ohm range (skips from 500s - 1K), but I believe the 550 Ohm would do OK, even if it does recommend 680Ohm resisters which RS carries (#271-1117). I test wired up the two on a 12v dry cell and they look comparable to me. The Fry's LED has no apparent illumination rating, but the other ones they had there were marked as 2 Candella and some had 8 Candella labels with warnings to not look directly into them . Sadly, no Blue in 8 Candella . To give you an idea, the Radio Shack one is measured in millicandela (mcd) so 8 candellas are = to 8000mcd LEDs. They might be too directional, but they didn't list that spec on the card. The resisters face Blue side to power lead and Gold Side to the long stem of the LED (+). Both are direction sensitive I believe.
I'm going to do the Sunroof etc. pod first and see how they go in there and how they look.
Originally posted by pIOUs I went to Fry's yesterday and picked up some blue LED's (#B4304H6-1 .20A) that seem comparable to Radio Shack's brightest off the shelf LED (#276-316). Fry's LEDs come with little plastic sleeve/holders which might be usefull at some point. I didn't find any resistors there in the 600 Ohm range (skips from 500s - 1K), but I believe the 550 Ohm would do OK, even if it does recommend 680Ohm resisters which RS carries (#271-1117). I test wired up the two on a 12v dry cell and they look comparable to me. The Fry's LED has no apparent illumination rating, but the other ones they had there were marked as 2 Candella and some had 8 Candella labels with warnings to not look directly into them . Sadly, no Blue in 8 Candella . To give you an idea, the Radio Shack one is measured in millicandela (mcd) so 8 candellas are = to 8000mcd LEDs. They might be too directional, but they didn't list that spec on the card. The resisters face Blue side to power lead and Gold Side to the long stem of the LED (+). Both are direction sensitive I believe.
I'm going to do the Sunroom etc. pod first and see how they go in there and how they look.
The Leds I used in my car were labeled "Super Bright LED." They also do not recommend looking straight at them. They cost 9 dollars for one at a electronic warehouse down in Los Angeles. I forgot what brand, but I heard some of the best ones are NICHIA.
Thanks checkmate98 The brightness of both LEDs were almost exactly as bright looking as the bulbs, but when you get right on axis they are really nice and bright.
I'm finished with the accessory pod (moonroof, Cruise, and Fogs each took on LED). I left the green "activated" lights and they complement each other well. I have to say I'm happy enough to do the rest. Pics are on the way by mid-week. Hopefully they all come back OK. It was a gruelling 4-5 hours to do this part right, and I've found a technique to replace the stock tiny bulbs so they will last. I'm going to do the A/C tommorrow (hopefully) and take a look at the guage assy to plan that part of it. I think I may have a connection for plug n play LEDs for the bigger gauge pods. I'm going to do as little alterations to the gauges to achieve the effect I'm looking for...Plus the LEDs I'm using for the individual buttons are fine for that, but not for the gauge assy (need brighter ones for that).
Originally posted by pIOUs Thanks checkmate98 The brightness of both LEDs were almost exactly as bright looking as the bulbs, but when you get right on axis they are really nice and bright.
Please keep in mind that all so called "Super Bright" LEDs at Radio Shack are considered 2nd rate compared to others. I read that on a LED website somewhere..i'll try to get the link and post it in here.
Originally posted by checkmate58 The Leds I used in my car were labeled "Super Bright LED." They also do not recommend looking straight at them. They cost 9 dollars for one at a electronic warehouse down in Los Angeles. I forgot what brand, but I heard some of the best ones are NICHIA.--Sam
Thanks for the lead. I did some more research on LED technology and verified that NICHIA is probably the best manufacturer of Blue LEDs (maybe with all colors). I gave up trying to find an electronics store that sells them wholesale or retail in Houston. Blue LEDs seem to have only been out for about 3 years so they are going to be hard to find over-the-counter. HOSFELT electronics sells a really bright one (6000mcd), but I bought the NICHIA. The bright blue (#NSPB500S) is a 4460mcd lumin product selling for $4.75 and the bright blue-green (#NSPE500S) is a 8000mcd product selling for $5. There is an $8 dollar minimum shipping charge and a $20 dollar minimum purchase for this company (they mostly do wholesale). The project is on hold until I receive and install them.
I believe the bulbs that back-light the guage the gauge are #168 size bulbs. If so I may try out a vendor who sells LED plug-n-plays for those. (edit: they are actually smaller than #168)
Update:
My LEDs haven't come in (ETA - 01/25/2002). I got anxious and decided to check out the inside of the OEM radio. The LCD display is back-lit and gets it's orange color from a tiny incandescent lamp that has an orange condom/diffuser on it. I unsoldered the contacts and unclipped it and removed the diffuser. I removed ALL the diffusers lighting the buttons and knobs. Coloring the bulbs with glass stainer seemed unwise; I was thinking that the lamps would burn it off and the color would fade, so I dyed the bulb notch in the acrylic face. The acrylic optics distributes the light behind each button produced from all the bulbs. There are little dimples in the acrylic that rap around the bulb. Those got dyed blue with glass stainer. I'm waiting for it to dry so I can reassemble and test. Update The ENTIRE acrylic diffuser must be dyed blue. I'm not sure if the LCD back-light is going to be too harsh. Update It's not bad to look at, but I went and took the LCD frame off and slid a blue transparent sheet behind it and it look good. This next technique didn't work(I left it undiffused, but stained the LCD housing from white to blue as best as possible through the lamp hole.) I'm guessing leaving everything white would be OK for some people, but I'm curious how the staining will diffuse behind the faceplate.
I don't recommend this part of the project to anyone who isn't VERY familier with electronic housing and assembly. They are not really meant to be tampered with. The face comes off easier than most though. 1) Take off the three nobs (just pull out). 2) unscrew two gold screws (one on each side; they are holding black plastic tabs off the face). 3)Work the snaps very carefully from the top and sides (the bottom is easier to work off last b/c the two plugs are holding the bottom on firmly. 4)Once you have the face off just unscrew the circuit board (2 screws) and tack the board to your safe work area .
I also changed the clock diffuser to blue. I bought a royal blue transparent sheet (for drafters, I think, at Hobby Lobby), but I really was looking for those diffusers that slide in front of stage lights (MARS music is too far from home though). I glue it on with black RTV silicone and it looks good. The surface of the sheet was scratched from being abused on the shelf, but it's not too noticable. I may use some in front of the LCD panel if the undiffused backlight seems too harsh.
I've been taking some pictures along the way (35mm) and should have the film developed tomorrow, but the finished night pictures will be on another role. So you'll have to wait if you're interested.
WOW....lots of work! I am glad you are in Houston! You gotta let me check it out!
__________________
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Well, my project is done for the most part. Here's what I found:
LED lights are a great idea for some of the following applications:
1)All three of the assy buttons on the left pod(Moon,Fogs,Cruise). They look very good.
2) The instrument panel does not lend itself to this sort of lamp. The LEDs are too directional and the optics do not help disperse or focus the light's beam. It could be done with more than 4, but they would not be plug n play and they would need a good solution for the acrylic optics behind the gauges. Indiglo gauges are a MUCH better solution for changing the color of you digit and needle display (plus you can get white one while you're at it). The results I got were poor light dispersal and dim patches. I'll take pictures with the Blue-Green color used. I used that color because it's a brighter hue with a very bright output (8000mcd). Update 01-29-02: I was able to incorporate LEDs into the guage cluster. I cleared out the needles, tinted them blue, maintained the OEM bulbs, but fired 6 LEDs into the acrylic diffuser to light up the needles. They look good. I recommend going with 4400mcd blue NICHIA LEDs for that part.
3) The AC/Heater assy responded well to the LEDs. Plug n playability is high even though I opted to paint the inside white instead of ABS plastic black. You should be able to use 6000mcd LEDs and do fine. They look indiglo without the bothersome intensity. I would recommend this swap for anybody with indiglo gauges vis-a-vis number 1).
4) The door "Auto" window toggle switch is a cavernous assembly that requires at least a 4000mcd lamp to pierce the "auto" see-through toggle. From the factory it comes with a dim output design (maybe so it won't be distracting). It won't seem worth it to do if you maintain this level of impact. I used a 2400mcd LED and it was as noticable as stock.
5) The Honda radio is a toss-up. Most people who would be interested in changing their interior lights would do this after they have indiglo guages and an aftermarket radio. Because I planned on doing this project before I did these things, I did the radio just for the pics...and curiousity. The only thing I would do here is remove the orange diffusers from the face bulbs and from the LCD backlight. This gives it a natural white look. I would then go with a sheet of flood light diffuser (a medium to dark intensity color). It all depends on the color that you want: the closer you get to purple the lighter you want that sheet of tinted transparency paper. Flood light gear tends to take this property in mind so the color you get should work. It goes either behind the clear shield on the face-plate, or if you're REALY skilled, put it behind the LCD. This requires several tiny hands (gator clip stands) and some skills with a soldering iron. The good thing is that you don't have to mess with the data pins, but the LCD metal frame housing is sorta spot welded to the board with one soldered pin. But that and a few clips and that comes off. Slip a cut piece of colored transparency behind it and you're off. What this does is hide the tint in the daylight behind the LCD screen and shows up at night when the backlight is fired up. I stained the buttom acrylic diffuser blue, but it showed through a little too unevenly for my taste. Stick with white and no worries.
6) The LCD Clock is pretty easy to take out. Again the diffuser must be swapped with at least 3 sheets (transparent flood light diffuser) of the color of your choice.
All and all it was hard. R&D projects mean trying something...installing it...tweaking it...trying something else, and putting it all together again. For me it was worth it to do #s 1,3,4and 6. The radio would have been fine if I could have found a good solution right at first. Number 2 was..well...appropriately numbered. I don't like it, but I'll keep trying things until my budget/time dries up again. Update 01-29-02: Do the indiglo needles. You don't have to take the needles off either!
Pictures will come in gradually as will more specific how-to's. Let me know which parts you want to do and I'll tell you what involved. For those who aren't good with fabricating LED assemblies (LED, and resistor with lamp-shaped contacts), will have to wait until they are commercially available or till we find somebody who can sell us exact plug-in versions.
These are my first go at pictures. Not so hot but I'll be updating the photo album as I go.
Just go here: http://www.imagestation.com/
The pictures do not include stuff like circling relevant objects and areas of interest. All that's left really is that and final night shots of the instrument panel.
Here's A pic showing the AC control Unit / Clock (since made darker blue) / and Radio This is after I reworked the needles, put back in the stock bulbs, and patched in LEDs embedded into the acrylic diffuser. I was experimenting with the different kinds of lamps here. Another with the lights on
The Project Photo Album is updated. Writeup will come later and the pics will be reformated showing relevant components. This Link should work even if the links to the pictures go bad.
Originally posted by pIOUs
Writeup will come later and the pics will be reformated showing relevant components. This Link should work even if the links to the pictures go bad.[/SIZE] [/B]
WoW great work pious~
i really want to change the bulbs too, but the asiankidd is charging too much...
anyway.. can u teach me how to do the A/C unit one, or do u have write-up?
thanx...
-SK-
wOw bravo! nice work you've done here. I've been wanting to do this for a LONG time but have neither the time, skill, nor balls~
anyways, for the authority on interior light swapping.. I think you all should check out this guy on the acuraTL forum. I know we're talking 'ludes here but I don't think the process/ordeal is much different. this guy definitely knows what hes doing and has the pictures to prove it.
there is more than one thread on the topic of interior lighting on this forum so search for this guy Nate ..hes earned the respect of his fellow TL'ers on the site and is even called the "Mod King"
IMHO, his custom work is some of the best I've seen in terms of LED swapping...
WoW great work pious~
i really want to change the bulbs too, but the asiankidd is charging too much...
anyway.. can u teach me how to do the A/C unit one, or do u have write-up?
thanx...
-SK-
Do pictures count? Check out the link in my sig "my photo album" under LED Retrofit or go to:http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4292086987.
I haven't done a writeup cause nobody really showed too much interest before. I've got Helm manual pages scanned in so you can take the AC out. As for the LED lights, it just depends. There is no one right way. Some have put LEDs right behind the buttons the way the green lights are set up, but that seemed too radical for my taste. If you fire the LEDs into (and mount them there with solder) the OEM light holes it will be slightly brighter than stock if you go with the LEDs I've recommended (I tested 4, but only 2 will be bright enough. If you want to WOW your friends and have crazy luminescence then you'll need to put the lights individually behind each button. See above posts for more details. It depends on where you want to make your statement; if the buttons are too bright it will be distracting and it wont match the intensity of the other button (on the left of steering wheel) which are limited in how they can be fitted. I haven't found a way to disassemble the cruise buttons etc. safely enough to fire the LED forward, so it won't match. I can recommend products for anyone wanting to try this, but check out the pictures first (some are poor quality, but I don't have a digi cam).
Quote:
Originally posted by TCB007
anyways, for the authority on interior light swapping.. I think you all should check out this guy on the acuraTL forum.
Thankyou for the recommendation and the compliments from both of you. Update RE: acuraTL forum I highly suggest looking through those threads. They are very informative and can give you new ideas. The problems encountered with the TL's instrumentation can be somewhat disregarded in this application though. NATE was very motivated to do the radio as I was, but our cars do not present the same challenge as far as directly replacing the head unit with one that has a blue display (their factory speaker require replacement). Also, our A/C unit doesn't have an LCD screen to retro-fit, and our has an acrylic diffuser to disperse the light into the button window. My view on this is that with some research, the diffuser can be used to cut down on the amount of LED's required to illuminate the buttons. Putting LEDs behind each button will make it bright, but the output would be too bright for some people to live with over time IMHO. Mine are fine (except the window switch), but I didn't want an extreme look. NATE had problems with finding a retailer for LEDs (no longer a problem), but he gave me some ideas about using different types of resisters and fitting the LEDs into the bulb screw-in bases. I opted for soldering the units directly onto the copper contacts. This allowed me to place them further into the sockets and manipulate the angle as needed for experimentation. I'd say that overall a prelude project would be much easier than a TL project. They recommended 1/8 size or chip style resistors whereas I used HUGE 1/4 size ones. Using smaller ones will allow you to work them into the curcuit board or into the twisty bulb bases. I like that idea. Another good idea I came across from one of thier Electrical Engineers is that 3 LEDs mounted in series would work without a resistor on a 12V platform. That rock for the gauge pod as is cuts down on the connections/wires/ and bulk wired into the gauge assembly.
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. Sadly, no Blue in 8 Candella
The brightness of both LEDs were almost exactly as bright looking as the bulbs, but when you get right on axis they are really nice and bright.
Linear Mode
