NITROUS 101<Newbies don't post until you read this, there will be a test>
If any disagrees with the information in this sticky please IM me, so that we can discuss it. Much of this information is what I was told when I started using nitrous and what I have learned since I've been spraying.
If someone asks a question that was answered in here, I will lock their thread.
Table of Contents
-Can I run nitrous on my car?
-Dry, Single fogger, Direct Port, and the Infamous Plate Kit: What's the difference?
-What to I need to run a X shot?
*50
*60
*75
*100+
-What brand should I get?
-Nozzle placement on single fogger and dry kits.
-Why do my sparkplugs look like this?
-I can't get traction with a 100 shot. Help!
*Nitrous controllers
*Two stage kits
*Wiring two stage kits
-Getting retarded
-Jet combos
__________________
SMSP
Hondata
194 whp/150 trq
Last edited by laughin2.2 : 04-05-2003 at 03:06 PM.
Can I run nitrous on my car?
Nitrous can be run on pretty much any car, whether it be stock or a fully built NA beast. If you have an older car or one with many miles on it, you will want to run a compression check. The numbers for each cylinder should be pretty close to each other and within Honda specs. For example, if you had 240, 238, 242, and 245 on a JDM H22A then it would be safe to run nitrous on that engine.
Secondly, aftermarket chips, ECUs, and Venom control modules that advance the ignition timing are not safe to use with nitrous. You may be able to use an MSD ignition timing controller or a Jacob's nitrous mastermind to retard the timing only when you are spraying, but it is very important to follow the rules for retarding your ignition timing when you are spraying nitrous. I will discuss these rules later in this post.
Finally, nitrous loves high compression, but the nitrous fuel ratio has to be tuned very precisely. 100 octane fuel will make it much easier to run high compression and nitrous, but it can be done to an extent on premium pump gas and good tuning.
There have been a rash of "Will nitrous blow up my prelude?" threads lately. Obviously we wouldn't be spraying on our babies if we thought it would hurt them, but to prove a point here is a link: http://www.nsxsc.com/ubb/Forum17/HTML/000011.html
__________________
SMSP
Hondata
194 whp/150 trq
Last edited by laughin2.2 : 05-15-2002 at 03:49 PM.
Dry, Single fogger, and Direct Port: What's the difference?
Dry Kits
Dry kits have a single nitrous nozzle plumbed into the intake tube(Mount the nozzle at least 6 in. from the TB) and they only spray nitrous into the intake. The extra fuel is provided by the injectors, when the ECU notices the extra oxygen molecules in the intake air charge. Dry kits can only be jetted up to a 75 shot because the nitrous is not distributed evenly to each cylinder. The injectors give an even amount of fuel to each cylinder, but because some cylinders are getting more than others you will get a dangerous lean condition in that cylinder. Running lean leads to predetonation, and predetonation is what blows motors.
Single Fogger Kits
A single fogger kit has one fogger nozzle mounted on the intake tube(Also 6in. from the TB). However, both fuel and nitrous are sprayed through this nozzle. This kit has a fuel solenoid and a nitrous solenoid, where the dry kit has just a nitrous solenoid. The idea behind this kit, is that spraying fuel with the nitrous will fix the lean condition that plagues dry kits that are jetted above a 75 shot. The problem with this is that fuel is heavier than nitrous and therefore it won't be able to make the turn to the first cylinder after the TB as well as the nitrous does. Honda intake manifolds are biased towards certain cylinders, which will still give uneven nitrous and fuel distribution when usinf a single fogger kit. Some people swear by these kits, but personally I'd rather plumb in a direct port kit for anything higher than a 75 shot.
Direct Port Kits
Direct port kits spray nitrous and fuel through single fogger nozzles on each intake runner. This is the only kit that can provide perfectly even nitrous and fuel distribution. This kit incorporates one nitrous solenoid and one fuel solenoid, just like the Single Fogger Kit. The only drawbacks to this kit is that it is hard to hide, and impossible to hide from someone who knows alot about nitrous. Also when you want to increase your shot, you have to change 8 jets as opposed to two on the Single Fogger Kit. A direct port kit can be jetted to as low as a 75 shot and to high as your motor can hold (Providing your solenoids can flow that much nitrous and fuel)
Plate Kit
The plate kit is basically the same as a direct port kit, but instead of having to tap the intake runners and run solenoid extension tubes you have a plate that is similar to a very thick gasket. The plate fits between the two pieces of the manifold. Tubes to carry the nitrous and fuel run through the plate and protrude across the intake tract. Like with the DP kit, you get very good nitrous and fuel distribution so you can spray higher shots safely. (laughin2.2)
The plate replaces the butterfly plate that separtes the two parts of the manifold. With the plate kit, you will lose the actual components of the butterfly valve, so all the intake runners will be open at all times. The tube that distributes the fuel and nitrous runs across the secondary runners that are blocked/unblocked by the valve. So the valve is replaced by the tube.(typeshlude)
__________________
SMSP
Hondata
194 whp/150 trq
Last edited by laughin2.2 : 05-02-2002 at 06:47 AM.
First of all, you must always run premium fuel(91+ octane).
Secondly, a purge kit is necessary to keep your kit running in peak condition. Nitrous in the lines is at pressures up anywhere from 900-1200 psi. When the nitrous solenoid gets hot, the rubber plunger inside of it becomes susceptible to the pressure from the nitrous and it can deform. If the plunger deforms it will block enough of the nitrous flow to cause the car to bog when the nitrous kit is activated. Heat is the main culprit and can deform a plunger in a matter of seconds, but if you leave the nitrous sit in the lines after a run it can deform even the coolest plug over time. Therefore, it is necessary to get a purge kit, so that you can purge the extra nitrous out of the line after each run. A purge kit is also nice for getting the gaseous nitrous out of your lines before a run and getting the ladies all excited.
50 shot
All that you need is a set of one step colder copper NGK plugs(NGK-BKR7E) or a set of Zex plugs(Two steps colder than stock) and you can keep the ignition timing at the stock timing.
NGK ZFR7F-11 plugs also appear to work and retain stock throttle response, but I haven't tested them yet. Use these at your own risk.
60 shot
You need the colder plugs and you will want to retard your ignition timing by a degree or two. You may want to look into getting an aftermarket ignition and spark plug wires.
75 shot
Retard your ignition timing by 3 degrees, pick up an ignition, colder plugs, spark plug wires, and look into getting a stronger clutch because your stock one will be slipping very badly. If you find that you are running lean or rich pick up a fuel pressure regulator. If you are running a direct port kit, then you can pick up an Apexi VAFC to control your fuel map.
100+ shot
While you can get away with running a 100 shot on a stock motor, I'm not going to recommend it. If you plan on running any shot higher than a 100 shot, you will need to beef up your bottom end. Forged pistons nd forged connecting rods are the first step. I have heard that it is necessary to resleeve the block in order to run forged pistons on H22As. Whether you believe this or not, is up to you. I figure that if you are going to build a block, you may as well go all out and resleeve it as well, but that's just me. Everything that you need for a 75 shot you will also need for a 100+ shot. It will also be necesarry to upgrade your fuel pump to a 225 lph pump. Walboro, NOS, and Holley are all good choices for fuel pumps. A preogressive controller will also be necessary to control the nitrous flow, so that you don't smoke the tires for the first 1/8 mile. NOS, NX, TNT, and Jacob's Electronics all make nice progressive controllers. 2 step colder plugs will help ward off predetonation, and it will be necessary to retard the timing 2 degrees for every 50 shot.
__________________
SMSP
Hondata
194 whp/150 trq
Last edited by laughin2.2 : 07-15-2003 at 10:59 PM.
NOS
NOS has been in the nitrous buisness for many years and has made a very good name for themselves. They produce single fogger kits, direct port kits, and dry kits. If you need a new solenoid, a nitrous line, nozzles, distribution blocks, etc. NOS will make a replacement part.
NX
NX is very similar to NOS. It is a good company, that makes quality parts, and they have been around for a while now.
Zex
Zex is the simplest dry kit that you can buy. The nitrous solenoid is housed in a purlpe control module. This makes it an easier install, but it also makes it so that you can't buy little individual parts to fix your kit, such as solenoid plungers,springs, etc. like you can with NOS and NX.
Venom
Venom is an expensive dry kit. It incorporates a computer program to control the nitrous flow and it also uses a program to watch your AF ratio, so that you don't run lean. While this kit is quite expensive and not my first choice, there have been no reported problems with the kit when installed properly. If you have the money and like computers controlling your nitrous, this may be the kit for you.
__________________
SMSP
Hondata
194 whp/150 trq
Last edited by laughin2.2 : 11-11-2002 at 11:10 AM.
Something I've noticed that's missing from the stickies and from the comments here about dry kit installations. For those of you who are worried about nitrous distribution, there is something you can do. Most kits tell you to place the nitrous nozzle immediately after or near your manifold, with most people drilling into their intake just before it connects.
The further back you place that nozzle from the manifold, the better distribution between cylinders you will recieve, as the nitrous has more time to mix inside the intake. The downside is that it also gives it more time to warm up, and the effect of the shot will be lessened from where the designers of the kit took their measurements. The reason they put the nozzle close is that there is a tradeoff between distance from the intake and the effect of the nitrous - e.g. the propagation lag that the nitrous takes from get to point A (nozzle) to point B (intake manifold).
This is something that nitrous users here can experiment with to see what works for them. It is especially interesting on the lower shot kits (which is where you see the dry kits being used) as a measureable percentage of the HP gains come not only from the extra oxygen N2O provides, but from the cooling effect nitrous has as well.
Steve/xtal
__________________
SMSP
Hondata
194 whp/150 trq
Last edited by laughin2.2 : 04-01-2002 at 09:44 AM.
How to run large shots without burning up your tires
Most of us start with a 50 shot, love it, and soon up the shot to 65, 75, etc. Pretty soon it is obvious that pumping an extra 75 whp out of your engine, while impressive on the dyno, doesn't do much for you ETs except for put a higher mph next to 14.xxx. A 100 shot should put a 5 spd H22A euipped prelude way into the low 13s, but without traction there is no hope.
There are two ways to put a large shot of nitrous to the ground. The first being nitrous controllers, which are expensive, but provide the most control of your nitrous kit. The second way is through a two stage kit, which provides two different size shots to the same engine.
Nitrous Controllers
Progressive controllers work by rapidly clicking the solenoids so that only a given amount of nitrous can get into the engine over a given period of time. The more often the soleoid clicks the less nitrosu gets through. This is particularly helpful with FWD vehicles which have a hard time putting down anything higher than a 75 shot on street tires. The idea is that you have a small precentage of your total shot(ex. 20% of a 75 shot) at 3k rpm and then increase the percentage by 20 for every 1k rpm after 2k rpm. Therefore you'd have 40% @ 4k, 60% @ 5k, 80% @ 6k, and the full shot at 7K. Of course this is just an example and the actual percentages would need to be adjusted for each car and track conditions.
The cons of progressive controllers is that the rapid clicking of the solenoids causes the rubber seals to wear out very rapidly. This can be fixed by ordering tougher seals from NOS, but the seals tend to run around $100 a piece. These seals will nto wear out, but they also do not seal as well as their rubber counterparts, which makes it necessary to have the car running whenever you open the bottle so that whatever nitrous may leak through the solenoid will not collect in the motor.
One safety measure that must be taken with progressive controllers is the use of a back up solenoid. This solenoid should be wired to open when the nitrous kit is activated, but to not be affected by the progressive controller. The rapidly changing current in the solenoid coils can cause them to fail over time and if they get stuck in the open position you could blow your motor. The back up solenoid will prevent the nitrous from reaching your motor is your primary solenoid does fail.
Jacob's Nitrous Mastermind (JNMM)
The JNMM retails for around $225 and is on the low end progressive controllers. It is a durable unit however and features a rev limiter, automatic timing adjustment when the nitrous is in use, a fuel pressure safety switch, and a progressive nitrous controller. Crane makes a similar product.
NOS and NX units
These units tend to run around the $500 mark, but are much more specialized in their ability to control the nitrous flow. The nitrous can be controlled in relation to time or RPM. These are top of the line products, but they are quite an investment for most people.
Two stage set ups
The theory behind two stage kits is to use a small enough shot in first and second gear that you can retain traction and as you get moving you can use a larger shot while still retaining traction. Think of it in terms of tubing. If you are hanging onto the rope and the boat comes tearing by you at 30 mph you won't be able to hold on. In contrast, if you are already going 30 mph and the boat speeds up to 60 mph you should be able to hang on much easier.
Since most FWD cars have trouble putting down anything more than a 75 shot in first gear. Therefore somewhere between a 40 shot and 60 shot would be ideal. Once you're into third gear or the top of second, you activate the 2nd stage and hang on for the rest of the ride.
Different two stage set ups
There are way too many different combinations of kits and ways of running multiple stages of nitrous that I'm only going to go into depth on the one I believe is the simplest to do.
Several users are running the NOS 05030FI kit, which is a four cylinder direct port kit. This kit is used to run the second/higher stage.
For the first stage we will use a single fogger set up. we will need two AN style Ts, six pieces of SS braided line, the appropriate fittings,one nitrous solenoid, one fuel solenoid, one fogger nozzle, the appropriate jets, and the wiring/relay. Undo the fuel and nitrous lines from the "IN" port of the solenoids. Place a T in each line. If you are running a purge kit, like you should be, place it directly upstream from the T in the nitrous line, unless you want to buy two purge kits. Next connect the two T's to their respective solenoids via the SS braided line and fittings. Tap the intake 7" from the throttle body, screw in the fogger nozzle, put in the right jets, and connect the fogger to the second set of noids via the last two pieces of SS braided line.
The wiring is a bit tricky and will require two arming buttons and two relays. This is NOS's wiring diagram for their two stage kits:
The NOS part # for the second relay is 15605S. .
__________________
SMSP
Hondata
194 whp/150 trq
Last edited by laughin2.2 : 11-11-2002 at 10:25 PM.
Getting Retarded
As previously mentioned the JNMM will retard your ignition timing when you spray, but it costs over $200. There are cheaper options.
Crane and MSD both make a timing controller adjustable up to 20 degrees of retard. I couldn't find a simple diagram of the MSD unit, but I'm assuming that it is the same as the Crane unit, which we do have a diagram for.
The Crane unit is activated by grounding the yellow wire from the unit. To just run retard during the second stage splice the yellow wire into the green wire before the pushbutton switch. The Crane unit goes for $140 on Summit.
Another way to retard timing is to use MSD's digital 6 ignition. It is part number MSD-6520 and goes for $280. The MSD 6A(MSD-6200) coupled with the Crane timing controller would cost $290. The downside of the MSD digital ignition is that it only has 10 degrees of timing retard available, but you will have to be running a very large shot for this to become a limiting factor. The ignition control is activated by a 12V power source being attached to the pink wire coming out of the MSD ignition.
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