Well since the race with the RSX type S and not fairing too well I have been thinking. I know if I could get a better start the race wouldnt have been "that" close... but i still cant help but be bummed.
Is there any way from here on out that I can have confidence with my h23 and nitrous? There are a lot of RSX's out there, srt4, wrxs etc, and i never ever run into any civics anymore or something that I am confident running against. Everytime I think I may end up racing I have little confidence in my car. I used to think that it was quick, but now I am not too sure. I just imagined that I would have killed that RSX in the race but since I didnt I am having these second thoughts.
I graduate from college this May and I would like to keep the lude, but I dont want to continue to feel that it is so slow. I imagine I will have a decent job and will have money to put into the car, but only if it is worth it. Whats the best way to step my car up and really give it some balls again? My options that I see are...
1. Lose the lude
2. Go turbo
3. Build around the nitrous
Is there anyway to get a h23 into the 13's without a turbo or a 100 shot? Please give me some advice.
Currently running a 65 shot, traction sucks, clutch "could" be performing poorly, aem cai, greddy evo, 1 step colder plugs. What should i pick up? Can i get my confindence back?
You still have lots of room for alot of improvemenmt. I suggest spending you make a choice, either invest a few grand into an h22 or dig into that h23. Get a good header (if you can) and some cams, pullies and a good clutch will also help. Dont forget the idea of a hondata (it will help your nitrous too if you let it do the controlling of it.) I suggest going vtec through the 22 or a hybrid, those will be the easiest ways to go a bit faster.....you see jdm h22 in your car running close to a flat 14 with little on them.
There will always be faster cars out there, and from the factory there are some nice options on fast stock cars. I mean, today I was at the track and there was an EVO running 13.3's with what looked like an intake/filter, downpipe and exhuast. H22's and H23's don't respond to mods like newer designed engines do as well as boosted engines. If you want to get serious about running fast it will cost some money. You might even consider changing platforms, there are plenty out there that are capable of running fast without dropping a load of cash
that is another thing i was considering... but then i dont know if emissions would be a problem by getting a jdm h22.
If i were to stay with the h23 and try to improve then the hondata s200 could be a decent choice. The S200 says it has n2o controls for a dry kit that adjust the timing and spray control, but will I need to get a new ignition as well with it or will it be included? Also I will need to get a p28 chip and convert my obd2 to run the S200... so what effect will that have on my everyday driving?
There are some new cams that have just come out by crower for the h23: Crower H23 Stage 2 Cams Ordered
If i were to go with stage one or two cams and get the hondata and get tuned, that would probably make some decent gains i would imagine?
Thought i'd add my .02 cents in since my current setup involves the s200 and nitrous. You said that u intend to spend more money when u get a nice job, the hondata would be perfect. You don't need to purchase the boost option with it since u don't have boost yet, but in the future u can upgrade it and then you could turbo whatever motor u have then.
If you stayed with the h23 and went with the hondata s200, the nitrous feature is GREAT!
It'll:
retard your timing
add fuel
only spray after a certain RPM
stop spraying at a certain RPM
only spray after a certain MPH
spray after at a %WOT
spray after a certain engine load.
You said that your traction sucks, is it because you spray in first? If so, i have mine setup to spray at a certain MPH when i just shifted into 2nd. So i launch normally and when i hit 2nd, it starts spraying.
Many features as u can see, but like kris told me awhile ago, it is all computer controlled and some would rather not have a "computer" controlling it. You don't need a new ignition, but if ur current one isn't the best, it might be time to upgrade.
You do have to convert your OBDII to OBDI, i'm assuming you have a 96 then, the cheapest way is to go with a p28 and everything that's needed to chip it comes with the hondata base unit. After u purchase the s200, you'll receive a base map for your setup, and you will have to get tuned at a hondata dealer/tuner. Not sure if there is one near you, but you can check on www.hondata.com .
I can't comment on the cams for the h23 since i don't know much about them, but usually cams, cam gears, and tuning yields some nice gains. If you have any more questions about the hondata unit, let me know! Sorry bout the long reply.
Thanks for replying! I came up with a few starting questions, I will have more.
Can you program the hondata yourself at all? If you want to make it so it sprays once you get into 2nd, can you make that change or do the tuner guys have to? Does the p28 chip go into my existing obdII ecu? Also, you said I dont need a new ignition, so then can I stick with the stock ignition and the s200 will still be able to retard it just once I hit second gear and the s200 starts spraying?
The place nearest to me has these prices:
s200 $295
For 96 to 2000 ODB2 to ODB1 cable $195
Premodified P28 $225
Do you think that is everything I need to convert to obdII and to have the s200?
Originally posted by Padge Thanks for replying! I came up with a few starting questions, I will have more.
Can you program the hondata yourself at all? If you want to make it so it sprays once you get into 2nd, can you make that change or do the tuner guys have to? Does the p28 chip go into my existing obdII ecu? Also, you said I dont need a new ignition, so then can I stick with the stock ignition and the s200 will still be able to retard it just once I hit second gear and the s200 starts spraying?
You do not NEED a new ignition, since the ECU runs of timing maps. So when it engages the nitrous, it automatically retards the timing the number of degrees you want it to!
If you go to www.hondata.com , they have a lot of good info and their prices. I'll give u quick rundown:
Base s200 system involves just being able to run your own chip in the ECU so a dealer can tune it. $295.
Datalogging is an extra $200, which just involves being able to hook up a laptop to the hondata "blue box" so you can datalog several different sensors. Doesn't allow you to change anything, just watch yourself and find out if you need to change anything. But you do NEED datalogging if u intend to tune it yourself with your laptop. So if you want to change when the nitrous engages, you'll need datalogging and the below stuff to make the changes yourself, or you could just go down to the nearest dealer/tuner and they can burn you a new chip.
ROM Editor software program is $200. It allows you to edit .bin files which include your fuel/ignition maps and various items. Nitrous feature, rev limits, vtec, secondaries (if a p72 is used from a GSR) etc..
ROMulator or Pocket programmer $180 each. You will need either one of these to actually make changes to your maps, settings, etc.. The ROMulator lets you hook it into the ECU and laptop and will allow you to make realtime changes while the car is running. "On the fly" changes. The pocket programmer is just a thing that allows you to "burn" new chips. But if u make a change, you'll have to burn a new chip or erase your current one each time and put it into the socket in your ECU.
Quote:
The place nearest to me has these prices:
s200 $295
For 96 to 2000 ODB2 to ODB1 cable $195
Premodified P28 $225
Do you think that is everything I need to convert to obdII and to have the s200?
Thanks, I will have more questions soon!
I sent you a PM about prices...
I'm pretty positive that the h23 also has secondaries like the h22, so if you want to keep using those, you'll need a p72 ecu, like stated above. The p28 is from a civic and it'll work fine but you do need to "socket" it so it can be used with hondata. I believe that is what they mean when they told you that it's "premodified."
It's not just a chip, it's an actual ECU that will replace your OBDII ecu and you'll put a chip with your program for your motor in it. Hondata doesn't work with OBDII, so since u'll be using a p72 or p28, you'll need to convert from OBDII ---> OBDI. Those are pretty expensive prices IMO....
Again, the hondata route is a pretty expensive route when it comes to just bolt on cars...but it's nice to have if you ever get "serious" about FI and tuning. Once you order your s200, you'll receive a base map to get started on your tuning based on your current setup. You will NEED to get it tuned so your running on a normal timing/fuel map as the base maps are just a starting point. Dyno tuning around my area is $140/hour so it does get spendy quick. But like everyone on this board will say, especially Kris, TUNING is key in keeping your motor running safely!
Again, sorry for the long post! If i missed anything, let me know. Anything to help out a fellow RED 4th genner!
Im pretty sure (i have heard before) that the s200 has an aux port that will control the secondaries. You also have the option of a non vtec ecu for your hondata. As for tuning it yourself,its cheaper to get you car done, then get a base s200 and have it tuned. why spend the extra cash on datalogging and things when (im assuming) you dont have much knowledge in tuning. I still say jdm h22. You will pass emissions with that too....you can always fund a usdm version also.....I say go for the vtec, its what makes hondas worth buying....
I do also recommend the jdm h22a. I don't have emissions in MN, but i have heard that they do pass emissions with the stock parts. But NXLude is right, if u don't know how to tune yourself, it is cheaper to just go somewhere and have it done and not buy all of those extra things.
what do you guys think would end up being cheaper? JDM h22 with install or hondata with install and tuning?
I know that PreludeRacer023 ran:
1/4 13.741 @ 101.76
his setup is:
94 JDM H22A-Aem Cai- Greddy SS header- Apex i N1 Exhaust- Skunk2 Cam Gears- chipped P28...Full interior
The motor will be more than the hondata (of course) but the gains on the motor will be much greater. Its the best choice for a starting platform. You could just hook up the juice to that one and go way faster, more reliably than digging into your h23.
Originally posted by Padge what do you guys think would end up being cheaper? JDM h22 with install or hondata with install and tuning?
I know that PreludeRacer023 ran:
1/4 13.741 @ 101.76
his setup is:
94 JDM H22A-Aem Cai- Greddy SS header- Apex i N1 Exhaust- Skunk2 Cam Gears- chipped P28...Full interior
I was under the impression that his time was freakishly fast for what he had, and that he shouldn't be used as the "how fast will my car be" benchmark.
The AutoGuide.com network consists of the largest network of enthusiast-owned enthusiast-operated automotive communities.
AutoGuide.com provides the latest car reviews, auto show coverage, new car prices, and automotive news. The AutoGuide network operates more than 100 automotive forums where our users consult peers for shopping information and advice, and share opinions as a community.
Linear Mode
