We are doing a full build on a 2001 Prelude SH. It has been fooled with before so I am here trying to get my facts straight before finishing this car (as we are basically removing everything and starting from scratch). Build will consist of a 6262SP Billet precision turbo, lovefab sidewinder manifold, fully built/sleeve engine (Golden Eagle HD sleeves), etc. We're looking to make it a 350-450whp daily driven car and a 500whp+ weekend warrior, which it should easily do. Our biggest problem is the ATTS and we're stumped on what to do with it. Will it support this kind of power? Do we need to just remove it/disable it? etc... This is not a drag race car, so even though it will make considerable power, we are building this to be a fun play toy to go out and mess with people.
I know this is my first post and I looked up ATTS and similar threads and found how to remove it, what it does, etc. I just want to know IF we need it or just to do away with and what to replace it with so we can get it on order to finish this car up. Everything else is done.
Any tips/advice/help would be greatly appreciated and I thank you for reading this post.
The atts disables its;ef automatically if it detects above 250 hp. How does it detect that? No clue. hahaha
Yes, if you are making over that Hp, it is dead weight. You mentioned you had already found a thread discussing the removal of the unit, so I guess you don't need help there.
remove it, it won't work. (and whether the power it detects is at the whee;s or at the crank, I don't know either; I don't know much, do I? hahahahah)
The atts disables its;ef automatically if it detects above 250 hp. How does it detect that? No clue. hahaha
Yes, if you are making over that Hp, it is dead weight. You mentioned you had already found a thread discussing the removal of the unit, so I guess you don't need help there.
remove it, it won't work. (and whether the power it detects is at the whee;s or at the crank, I don't know either; I don't know much, do I? hahahahah)
Perfect ok, so ATTS gone. Check. What do you recommend on the rest of the setup? Does the 01 SH come with a factory LSD or is the factory tranny able to hold any power?
The factory USDM trannys do not come with LSD. That's why they come with ATTS. They both affect torque in your differential. Only ATTS does it a little more efficiently I would think.
The stock trannys seem to be quite durable, since I have heard multiple people over the years running 450+hp and no issues with their trans other than grinding because they shift hard and run their car into the ground...
As for the setup...hmmm, not quite sure exactly what "setup" you are speaking of. Clutch?
Yeah, I'd seriously consider replacing the clutch with one of those (at the very least) "stage 2" or "stage 3" clutches, since you'll be throwing down some serious power.
You may even need toconsider some High performance axels....but I don't know much about them since I haven't really heard of many people using them.
\
Just to touch on the LSD topic a little more. Ok.....LSD was offered from the factory in certain preludes, but they were only in Japan. So you can pay usually $800-$1000 for an imported Trans with LSD.....but I have heard that the LSD's are "weak" on a thread once....and it'd cost you just as much to install a better LSD differential in your trans. They cost about $1k and however much to install. I heard they are more efficient.
The factory USDM trannys do not come with LSD. That's why they come with ATTS. They both affect torque in your differential. Only ATTS does it a little more efficiently I would think.
The stock trannys seem to be quite durable, since I have heard multiple people over the years running 450+hp and no issues with their trans other than grinding because they shift hard and run their car into the ground...
As for the setup...hmmm, not quite sure exactly what "setup" you are speaking of. Clutch?
Yeah, I'd seriously consider replacing the clutch with one of those (at the very least) "stage 2" or "stage 3" clutches, since you'll be throwing down some serious power.
You may even need toconsider some High performance axels....but I don't know much about them since I haven't really heard of many people using them.
\
Just to touch on the LSD topic a little more. Ok.....LSD was offered from the factory in certain preludes, but they were only in Japan. So you can pay usually $800-$1000 for an imported Trans with LSD.....but I have heard that the LSD's are "weak" on a thread once....and it'd cost you just as much to install a better LSD differential in your trans. They cost about $1k and however much to install. I heard they are more efficient.
Questions?
Sorry by setup I just meant differential setup and similar. It has a competition clutch stage 4 (sprung 6 puck), ultralite flywheel, ATI damper, etc going in, but I did not know if we needed to put a quaiffe or similar into it or if the factory open diff would shatter itself or similar under heavy power (we don't do a lot of extreme power on the H series stuff). If the base MT/DIFF will handle ~450-500hp or even remotely close thats perfect. There won't be a lot of shockloading (launches/slicks/etc) so that should be perfect then. I am sure he needs an LSD as it more than likely will be a one wheel wonder otherwise lol, but I am just looking at necessities as this is going to be an expensive build for him.
Correct on the ATTS, thats why I was confused on what to go with. Removing it and going base transmission seems to be the best option now and add a quaiffe if he wants?
You are defiantly going to need to address the trany, if people are making that kind of HP on a stock trany it will go in time. Then there is the 5th gear grinding problem that will come up and most likely worsen as power increases. I suggest looking at getting yours built, there are many companies that build theses tranys with good stuff in them. They are usually not much more then getting a JDM LSD tranny that you are going to have problems with finding replacement gear or syncros. Also the SH block is different than the base H22 block so keep in mind that the base tranys will not bolt up to it. The SH type trany don’t come with an LSD from any market US/JD/ED there all ATTS.
I would suggest trying to get a base block/tranny and build that as your option on trannys and ratios open up a little easier. Some would say to use an F series tranny if you’re going to make that kind of power anyhow. As the prelude tranny have short ratios and the JDM/EDM LSD trannys have some even shorter 4th and 5th gears, although theses tranny only bolt up to the base H22.
I have heard some things about synchrotech-transmissions.com/
You are defiantly going to need to address the trany, if people are making that kind of HP on a stock trany it will go in time. Then there is the 5th gear grinding problem that will come up and most likely worsen as power increases. I suggest looking at getting yours built, there are many companies that build theses tranys with good stuff in them. They are usually not much more then getting a JDM LSD tranny that you are going to have problems with finding replacement gear or syncros. Also the SH block is different than the base H22 block so keep in mind that the base tranys will not bolt up to it. The SH type trany don’t come with an LSD from any market US/JD/ED there all ATTS.
I would suggest trying to get a base block/tranny and build that as your option on trannys and ratios open up a little easier. Some would say to use an F series tranny if you’re going to make that kind of power anyhow. As the prelude tranny have short ratios and the JDM/EDM LSD trannys have some even shorter 4th and 5th gears, although theses tranny only bolt up to the base H22.
I have heard some things about synchrotech-transmissions.com/
Ok perfect... this is exactly where I was leading to with this thread. I just didn't want to say anything about building gears or similar as generally on a forum everyone will then say "yes its a good idea to build gears, do this do that etc". I know its a good idea to build everything, I just want someone whos either done it or has experience with if its actually needed or necessary or what power lvl they fail or etc. I wanted someone to come out and say, I would recommend this because at X power level they will end up failing. If its going to need to be built, this may get a little more messy and we'll just have to limit the power for now. I'll give syncrotech a call and see what they have to say as well on my options.
I have been reading around on here and it seems that theres an adapter block or plate needed to bolt the base transmission up to the SH block (22a4 correct?). Does anyone know where to find this or is there a company that already makes this? We unfortunately have already built the block up with GE sleeving and the whole nine yards ($400-500+ in machine work on top of the sleeving to get the bearings/crank/etc all perfect in spec) so we can't undo this as it would costs thousands more and put us months behind as we get into winter (everyone slows down).
Thanks for the information and thanks in advance for the help!
Unfotunately syncrotech doesn't have a gear upgrade option available for the h22 transmission, only carbon synchros and oem LSDs I believe. I will keep hunting.
If you want to boost, sell the SH and buy a base. The ATTS technology is not something to just be thrown away. If you don't want it, don't use the car.
__________________
1988 Prelude S - victim of an 80mph backflip
1991 Prelude Si - sold
1989 Accord DX - impounded
1998 Prelude SH - bolt-ons dynoing @ 173whp&140tq
2006 CRF150F - sold
2006 YZ250F
I'm asking a guy....the only one I know with a 400+hp H22. I am pretty sure his started stock....then he put synchrotech synchros in it....he blew it up since it wasn't assymbled correctly.
I'm trying to find out if there is such things as modifying our tranys. i haven't seen a market for it....EVER.
But then again, I haven't seen a lot of high-HP Preludes either.
OP--Sorry I sort of led you in the wrong direction. I really don't think most peoples trannys are "built" per-se......but yeah. Jim is right.....very few stock production vehicle trannys would be able to handle 500 HP for a long time. Unless you never actually drove it liek it should be.
Ok perfect... this is exactly where I was leading to with this thread. I just didn't want to say anything about building gears or similar as generally on a forum everyone will then say "yes its a good idea to build gears, do this do that etc". I know its a good idea to build everything, I just want someone whos either done it or has experience with if its actually needed or necessary or what power lvl they fail or etc. I wanted someone to come out and say, I would recommend this because at X power level they will end up failing. If its going to need to be built, this may get a little more messy and we'll just have to limit the power for now. I'll give syncrotech a call and see what they have to say as well on my options.
I have been reading around on here and it seems that theres an adapter block or plate needed to bolt the base transmission up to the SH block (22a4 correct?). Does anyone know where to find this or is there a company that already makes this? We unfortunately have already built the block up with GE sleeving and the whole nine yards ($400-500+ in machine work on top of the sleeving to get the bearings/crank/etc all perfect in spec) so we can't undo this as it would costs thousands more and put us months behind as we get into winter (everyone slows down).
Thanks for the information and thanks in advance for the help!
There is not a company that makes the adapter plate to bolt up a non-SH transmission to the SH Block. However, if you search on this thread, there is a diagram and even a CAD File you can download that you could give to the right shop and they'd make it for you. There is also detailed instructions on how and what you need to do. Just search for "adapter plate" or something like that.
I'm in your same boat. However, I'm not really putting any more money into my car, so I never got to do this modification. I too, am running a fully built SH block (by Golden Eagle) with the ATTS Transmission still on the block, but it's disabled due to me now running Hondata.
I don't know if this matters or not, but I have seen proof that even with the ATTS still on, I'm laying down roughly two even strips of rubber when i do a first gear launch. I did it in a Wal-Mart parking lot at night semi-accidently and I stopped the car and got out to see if I was spinning only one wheel. This is the only time that's happened to me and I got out to see the net results, so take it for what it's worth but it almost seems like even with ATTS disabled, it still has some benefits of being an LSD in a straight line.
Good luck on getting your block adapter plate, make me one for free while you're at it, haha.
If you were going to get the transmission rebuilt, then couldn't you also get the ATTS unit rebuilt (new clutches, etc.) to handle the extra power? Then just need to intercept whatever signal disables it.
Is it possible to use the H 2 B kits with the sh block......that may be a good solution to your atts issue. As far as lsd's go i have a stock jdm lsd and a quaiffe, both work well but to get the quiaffe it costed me almost 800 and then to get it installed was another 600, so for a total of 1400 i had it. The jdm trans substantially less however you can tell the quaiffe is better then the jdm, especially on launch.
No, but they've got way more aftermarket support making rebuilding to whatever specs you want easier and cheaper than doing it to an H-series.
As for the H2B kit, you'd still need to make that adapter plate, there are always intermediate shafts with a FF layout because the tranny is always on one side of the engine bay
If you were going to get the transmission rebuilt, then couldn't you also get the ATTS unit rebuilt (new clutches, etc.) to handle the extra power? Then just need to intercept whatever signal disables it.
Except nobody's ever done that before, so he would be a total pioneer. I don't think that's what he wants. Plus, it's not a signal that disables the unit. For that level of power, you have to run some kind of standalone, and in that case you will never be able to interface with the ATTS controller.
Quote:
Is it possible to use the H 2 B kits with the sh block......that may be a good solution to your atts issue. As far as lsd's go i have a stock jdm lsd and a quaiffe, both work well but to get the quiaffe it costed me almost 800 and then to get it installed was another 600, so for a total of 1400 i had it. The jdm trans substantially less however you can tell the quaiffe is better then the jdm, especially on launch.
I've never seen an H2B kit actually installed in a Prelude. All of the H2B guys are using civics. I don't think there are axles available for a Prelude installation.
To the OP: I didn't want to ask, but why choose a Prelude for this? Even a 600hp Prelude won't be fast. It's too heavy and too little traction. Most power levels above 400hp have similar timeslips. If you want to build a fast drag car, the Prelude is a pretty bad choice.
__________________
I am not an active moderator on this site anymore. Please contact Phryxis or liquidxnitez for help with your issues.
I am sure if axels are the only thing preventing an h2b in a prelude then the Driveshaft shop should be able to make some custom ones(as long as you are willing to spend the coin to have it done).
True... If you were to use the H2B in a prelude, you would have to get custom axles done. That's not particularly a hard thing to do, as there is a company on the internet somewhere that you'd just have to tell them you want the axle to fit the hub of a 5th gen prelude on one end and on the other end you'd need it to fit a B16A2 transmission input and then measure from end to end and give them that measurement so they could ensure it was the right length.
There is not a company that makes the adapter plate to bolt up a non-SH transmission to the SH Block. However, if you search on this thread, there is a diagram and even a CAD File you can download that you could give to the right shop and they'd make it for you. There is also detailed instructions on how and what you need to do. Just search for "adapter plate" or something like that.
Found this file and we have solidworks and CAD capabilities. I am just trying to make sure we're only talking about an adapter plate for the intermediate shaft and not a spacer or adapter to physically bolt the transmission to the block (as the drawing file actually seems to be just an adapter plate for the intermediate shaft to bolt up to. If thats it, I am not too worried.
I'm in your same boat. However, I'm not really putting any more money into my car, so I never got to do this modification. I too, am running a fully built SH block (by Golden Eagle) with the ATTS Transmission still on the block, but it's disabled due to me now running Hondata.
Trust me, if we can get away with this, then I want to. The simpler we can make this car the better. How much power are you putting down with the ATTS disabled? Any problems?
I don't know if this matters or not, but I have seen proof that even with the ATTS still on, I'm laying down roughly two even strips of rubber when i do a first gear launch. I did it in a Wal-Mart parking lot at night semi-accidently and I stopped the car and got out to see if I was spinning only one wheel. This is the only time that's happened to me and I got out to see the net results, so take it for what it's worth but it almost seems like even with ATTS disabled, it still has some benefits of being an LSD in a straight line.
Exactly, I would still think it would have some effect even with the ATTS not active. So ideally I would love to just disable it and leave it in the car if the transmission will hold roughly any kind of good power 300-400whp. Then just buy a base transmission for backup and build it later to make the power with I guess.
Good luck on getting your block adapter plate, make me one for free while you're at it, haha.
Its not exactly a complicated design or expensive (i mean its a 3/16" plate cut out and a 1/8" plate). Nothing too crazy or complicated. So I am sure I will have left over scrap and will cut as many as I can on a sheet =).
The AutoGuide.com network consists of the largest network of enthusiast-owned enthusiast-operated automotive communities.
AutoGuide.com provides the latest car reviews, auto show coverage, new car prices, and automotive news. The AutoGuide network operates more than 100 automotive forums where our users consult peers for shopping information and advice, and share opinions as a community.
Linear Mode
