I'm not a HC competitor yet, but IMO I would actually like to see the spec tire rule go away. This is because it allows the competitors to work out some tire deals with whichever tire brand they choose.
__________________ 2009 BMW 335i Coupe, Alpine White/Black Dakota, 6MT
2010 Audi S4, Ibis White/Magma Red, 6MT
Judging by the responses elsewhere, everyone feels the same!
I'm all for a spec tire in a completely, designated "spec" class from inception. But it really hurts the competitors when the rules change after a class has been allowed to be run a particular way for a time. During that time some competitors have developed a set up, and driving style for one particular tire. That investment has been nullified.
As Vincent said, they are not able to work out deals with tire manufacturers for the tires they like, and now the ones that have, have to go back and say "sorry" I can't run your tire anymore.
In regards to the argument that the "smaller" classes (like the SE-R cup) don't get to have tire deals, if the competitors in those classes choose then they can vote to mve to a spec tire...
I'm not an HC competitor yet, although I'm (slowly) working towards it.
The way I look at it is, if you're going to make me use a particular tire, at least give me a good (i.e. 30% off retail or so) deal on them. The contingency money isn't really an issue for me. A spec tire makes sense in a spec class, IMO.
Again, I'm not a racer, so take these opinions with a grain of salt. Maybe I'll change my mind after I actually do some wheel-to-wheel, I don't know.
I think a spec tire will hurt the series. Basically everyone that isn't in Cali, which had a spec tire from the inception and doesn't know any different, feels strongly against a spec tire. NASA did what it though was a favor to HC by getting this spec tire deal; unfortunately it blew up in their face.
__________________ David Rierson
Marcucci Motorsports
98 Prelude #53 NASA Honda Challenge
03 Acura RSX
04 Nissan Armada
06 Kawasaki KLX250S
I bought a few tires of a Spec Miata/Miata enduro guy locally, ... I guess in this region they just recently went from open tires to a Spec Toyo also. (I don't know, I don't pay attention) and he said that his "team" was serisouly considering running elsewhere, because the tires got greasy and unpredictable after 12 laps of the long course at TWS.
(As a side note, he had not one, not 2 but 4 simulators at his house, 2 disassembled Formula atlantic cars in the "garage", his sons midget in the drive, and some Lotus in the shop "from his days in europe"... I should brought a camera)
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacques,Mar 8 2006, 12:15 PM
Damn you guys and your Miatas!
2007 FP... 6fth; 2008: just tryin not to be DFL
Last edited by mtbprelude; 01-16-2006 at 09:12 AM.
It definitely did not work out for the best, and it's seriously endangered the future of the series--but there aren't alot of other options. I'm not sure i want to drive ITA, though the DA9 is fairly competitive (even at it's new insane min. weight).
I think we'll have to suck it up and hope things work out better next year (or however long this contract is). I guess i miss the idea of HC as THE up and coming class for club racing around the country. And NASA National has proven to be pretty hamhanded when it's come to big decisions--but the same could be said about the SCCA.
and so it goes. I'm still building an H4 car, and spec tire or no, i'm gonna be racing in '07.
What would happen if all the drivers in the class agreed to say "**** the rules," show up on Kumho and Hoosiers, and run anyway with an agreement to not protest each other over tires...
What would happen if all the drivers in the class agreed to say "**** the rules," show up on Kumho and Hoosiers, and run anyway with an agreement to not protest each other over tires...
I think they just won't be able to collect points for the races.
__________________ 2009 BMW 335i Coupe, Alpine White/Black Dakota, 6MT
2010 Audi S4, Ibis White/Magma Red, 6MT
What would happen if all the drivers in the class agreed to say "**** the rules," show up on Kumho and Hoosiers, and run anyway with an agreement to not protest each other over tires...
That would never happen. There'd always be one person to ruin it and actually run on the spec tire to collect points and say "haha suckers."
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by ExodusFX
It doesn't matter what kind of icecream you get in Mochi. Why? Because Mochi is icecream wrapped in awesome.
HC in Texas isn't big, so I don't think it'll affect HC here. I'm still planning to get my license this year (although I won't make it to the season opener). The new PT class looks promising, though.
for 1 you can run what ever tire you want in PT, and maybe some regions will score a good Kumho deal for PT... we just have to wait and see. I will race wich ever class has the best chance of getting some $$ back.
HC in Texas isn't big, so I don't think it'll affect HC here. I'm still planning to get my license this year (although I won't make it to the season opener). The new PT class looks promising, though.
My understanding is that PT is sharing the same points system as TT, and I've got some good news for you! http://www.nasa-tt.com/rules.php
The calculator here says that (for a unboosted car) a programmable EMS system that can be reprogrammed at the track is 6 points, 5 points if reprogrammable elsewhere.
It's only 2 points for a "reflash" or "performance chip."
I think the version of neptune that you have qualifies as the 2 pointer.
I'm going to be talking to James about not only giving discounts for people upgrading to the RTP system, but for NASA competitors who want to be classed better who want to tune themselves, but have the non-programmable Neptune system installed for classing purposes. (ie: buying RTP neptune and having that tune burned and installed as standard neptune)
I think Neptune, Hondata, and whatnot are +6, regardless of the whole reflash deal because these systems give the user complete control over the fuel and timing maps. Although my version of Neptune would be +5 since I cannot change the maps at the track.
The rule is worded
Quote:
Reprogrammable ECU chip, reflashable computer, or aftermarket computer system that can directly control engine timing maps and/or fuel injector pulse, allowing fine tuning: 1) at the track +6 nat. aspirated, +11 turbo/supercharged 2) elsewhere +5 N.A., +8 tubor/ S/C. (Do not also take points for performance chip/reflash)
I only thing I see that could be a problem is a well built Prelude would get bumped up into PTA.
I also haven't quite figured out where my shocks would fit in...
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