Driving Style - Honda Prelude Forum

MtangKlr · 03-21-2007, 11:17 AM

Do you guys engine brake rather than use your regular brakes? When approaching a corner are you on the Gas to the last moment then on the brakes just before entering the corner or do you just let off to cut some speed and then jump back on the gas after the Apex?

paulyg · 03-21-2007, 11:54 AM

There is no correct answer to this. It totally depends on the corner and circumstances. If your current speed is close to the upcoming cornering speed then yes I would just back off the gas and turn in. Sometimes there is a fast but tight corner or kink where you have to just tap the brake to get the some weight transferred to the front so the car will turn. This is where left foot braking becomes really useful.

You have to have all these different techniques in your repertoire. Deciding when to use what only comes with experience.

MtangKlr · 03-21-2007, 12:06 PM

Good stuff. Thanks! I put some of the techniques that were mentioned from this site to good use the weekend before last. Especially number 8 from this list: http://www.dmvrscca.org/topten.htm

The set up we usually run at the Corvette meet has a very large criss-cross style almost like shoe laces with a series of chicanes to break things up. I find that I'm very competitive when I just engine brake around high speed corners and get on the gas sooner and with more speed but when I watch the corvettes that post better times than me they tap the break before entering that corner then power out of it. I managed to run 3rd fastest all day, only to be put out by an preped M3 and Z06. Which I've come to realize that its not the Car its the driver. when I go to "Test and Tune" sessions I'm usually posting pretty good times but when I go to an SCCA even the times are alot closer to mine and DAMN if those Miata's aren't fast!!-I want one. an S2k in the hands of a good driver is amazing also!

Also is there a Technique for an increasing radius turn?

How do I properly make a Hair pin turn in a FWD car with out plowing and carrying the most speed possiable?

Mugenlude · 03-26-2007, 10:57 AM

Every corner varies, and you need to access each situation individually. You have to remember that in most cases the Corvette is going to be carrying more speed into corners that you are, so it will probably need to brake more often to get the car down to the speed required to make the next maneuver (they my also be on different tires than you if you are in ST*).

I approach increasing radius turns in general the same as standard apex turns you want to get on the gas sooner than you would for a standard apex turn because you don't have to turn as much. You still need to make sure you are on your mark exiting the corner because being faster off-line isn't going to help.

This is how I approach a hair pin turn: Out early to reduce the arc of the car as you approach the cone so you can be on the gas sooner. Here is a rough example of what I'm talking about, again it varies from maneuver to maneuver... green = acceleration, red = braking, dashed red = left foot trail braking/throttle modulation to setup car...

Mugenlude · 03-26-2007, 10:59 AM

The more I look at that drawing, it might be somewhat out of scale... I think a wider line coming in would be better, but you get the general idea.

MtangKlr · 03-27-2007, 06:01 AM

Ok, will i get a better Idea as to how wide to take the car on the entry with experience. Would 30ft off the hairpin cone be giving to much room for the manuver? The one that they usually set up doesn't have more than 12ft to the edge of the course so going wide is really out of the question but for other instances this would be good to know.

MtangKlr · 03-27-2007, 06:02 AM

Nice diagram BTW

ImagePree · 03-27-2007, 08:50 AM

That diagram would change if you were driving the SH.

Mugenlude · 03-27-2007, 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MtangKlr

The one that they usually set up doesn't have more than 12ft to the edge of the course so going wide is really out of the question.....

In that case I would get all of the way out to the outside of the course and use a similar maneuver to late apex (or 'get behind') the pin cone.

Mugenlude · 03-27-2007, 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ImagePree

That diagram would change if you were driving the SH.

I don't have an SH, so I don't have experience with the situation... however, I would assume that the point you get on the gas would just be changing, not the line you are driving.

PininFarina456 · 03-27-2007, 01:25 PM

^^Yea, essentially you would carry more speed through the turn.

ImagePree · 03-27-2007, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mugenlude

I don't have an SH, so I don't have experience with the situation... however, I would assume that the point you get on the gas would just be changing, not the line you are driving.

Well, the line would change a bit since you'll be on the gas a little sooner. With ATTS working, you would indeed be driving a much tighter line and that would require that you apex a bit earlier as well.

Granted, I have never driven a base on the track or autox course so please take the above with a grain of salt.

Given your diagram, I would do this.

1. Brake zone will start a little earlier.
2. Earlier apex.
3. Setting up car (red dashes) would be much shorter.
4. Foot on gas about 1/2 to 3/4 on your red dashes.

Step 3 would depend heavily on getting the ass around. This should not be hard to do with a little conservative trail braking.

One example I can remember clearly where ATTS helped me power out before the banked left turn was on Pocono South course during the 1st ever PO track meet.
At this particular left hander, by the time I had cleared the turn, it was time to shift into 3rd well in VTEC. This made my terminal top speed by the end of the banked gentle left hander MUCH higher than everyone else. Of course, there was a wall at the end of this, so I did not try for absolute top speed before going into yet another tight left.

Anyway, my point is if he were driving an SH, there are many factors to consider and this would contribute to a much different mindset.

MtangKlr · 03-28-2007, 07:53 AM

I'm in a base. But I have a good suspension setup.

Jacques · 03-28-2007, 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MtangKlr

I'm in a base. But I have a good suspension setup.

Like See, my driving line is pretty close to how he describes it (I'm in an SH as well)...my advantage is that I can get into throttle sooner and my corner entry line is a little tighter (to a degree) with the help of ATTS. Since you are in a base, assuming that your suspension is somewhere between balanced to slight oversteer, then setting up wider as Jason mentioned to build up your speed on your corner exit would be the best way. Adjust appropriately depending on the space you have to maneuver. Also, depending on the maneuver you're doing prior to the turn (ie: slalom, offsets, etc.), you want to get your braking done as soon as possible. With a combination of trailbraking/throttle modulation, get back into speed without losing too much momentum. Finally, what I always tell people...drive smooth! If you are able to manage a good flow from element to element, it will help cut down on your time.

ImagePree · 03-30-2007, 01:47 PM

Reiterating James' point about driving smooth, make all of your transitions as fluent as possible will help you more in the long run than being herky-jerky just to stay in-line.

If you find yourself having to overly adjust steering angle during or immediately after apex, something isn't right. So positioning and braking heading into the turn becomes that much more significant.

Crap. All this talk is making me wanna jump back into autoxing.