Tried looking at everything I can think of, car just wont start... any suggestions? - Honda Prelude Forum

ludestarbai · 10-06-2010, 11:39 PM

Hey guys...

Thanks to anyone who takes the time to read this... I'm gonna try to keep it short but I want to be through to explain fully everything I've tried.

The issue first of all is that the car wont start... it behaves the way it would if you turned the key without pressing in the clutch pedal. Turn the key everything lights up hear a click from a relay (not sure which) under the dash, but no signal that I can hear goes to the starter at all... zero attempt at cranking.

The car once had a basic alarm which was disconnected by the previous owner, and it ran fine. Though it was 'disconnected' it was still present under the dash so I figured I'd start by removing it. It seemed to only really be tapped into the power door locks and parking lights... I followed all the wires and the only things it were still attached to were t-tapped in no cuts in the wires that I could tell... so removed it completely, and I'm pretty confident it has nothing to do with my problem. (Open to suggestions if I'm wrong here)

Next I attempted to diagnose a potentially faulty iginition switch, I tested it for continuity exactly as described in the svc manual and it seems to be working right.

Next I tried testing the switch on the clutch pedal... according to the method in the svc manual, and it is getting continuity so I assume thats in working order.

I checked the 50Amp fuse underhood and its good, checked the 7.5Amp fuse in the kick panel and ITS good.

I dont know for sure, but I dont think its the MAIN relay because my previous Prelude went through a bad relay and it acted up for weeks before it was shot, and it at least cranked though it wouldn't turn over the motor... This isn't behaving the same way as that.

I checked the starter itself by 'jumping' the battery straight to the starter itself and it did start to crank the motor.

Now I'm not an expert with a multimeter, I have a general idea on how its supposed to work, and so I decided to just try testing random stuff at this point (and by randm I mean not explained in the svc manual) I tested the continuity from the wire in the underhood fuse box, to the wire going into the starter... I thought that this would test the continuity from the fuse box to the starter... the multimeter beeped so i -ASSUME- that that means that my real problem here is between the ignition switch and the under hood fuse box.

So the only thing that I can think of that I haven't fully tested is the Starter Cut Relay in the kick panel fuse box.... So I pulled the relay and with the multimeter I tested continuity between the coil power and coil ground on the relay itself, I dont get the same beep that I get from my multimeter when I test for continuity the way the svc manual says I should... the meter reads '0.62' -- and no beep. I'm no electrician so I dont know exactly what .62 means... is that a good indicator that this is where my problem can be? I can't test the relay fully tonight because i do not have a 12v source... when i go back to the car tomorrow and have access to the battery I will try testing it again.

Theres a whole bunch of other things to test I know in terms of the fuel pump etc... but beacuse the starter isnt even attempting to start I just assumed that thats where my problem is first and foremost. If thats at stupid assumption, please educate me... I'm trying to read everything i can find to figure this out... Been through the service manual.

I am sure someone is going to tell me to check my grounds... I inspected them all visually and they looked okay but I'm pretty sure I need to do more than that, can someone tell me how to though? Can I use the multimeter to figure that out? Other wise what else should I do? Unattach all of them and clean them off and re attach? How do I clean them? Use a bit of sand paper? Sorry if all of these are basic questions but I spent a few hours checking everything I can think of within my skill set, and nothing worked so now I'm out to try to figure out what else I can try.

Again sorry for such a long post but I figure the more info I can provide, the better the help I can hope for. Thanks in advance guys.

indylude18 · 10-07-2010, 07:27 AM

You sir, have got a mess.

It's got to be a problem somewhere in the starter circuit if you've ruled out the ignition switch and the clutch switch.

Your only real option at this point is to go here: SpoonerTuner.com - Free downloadable Honda Acura Factory Service Manuals by HELMS and download the electrical guide Kronn posted. That should list every wire in the starter circuit and...sadly...you will just have to check them all one at a time until you find a short or weak connection somewhere.

Typically, an alarm will be wired somewhere into the ignition circuit, I'd start there.

If you want to confirm that it is only a starter related problem try to push start the car. If everything else is still working right, you should be able to push start it and it should run fine. If it won't push start....well then you've got multiple problems.

~GL

spin_r_g · 10-07-2010, 08:18 AM

What brand of alarm was it?

y2kflh · 10-07-2010, 08:39 AM

You didn't mention if the car hasn't started since you removed the alarm. If so, 90% of the time an obvious cause to a problem is just that, and it's related. I'd double check all those wires, even look up the colors in a repair manual schematic to see what each one does. Many alarms disable the starter circuit.

ludestarbai · 10-07-2010, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by indylude18

You sir, have got a mess.

It's got to be a problem somewhere in the starter circuit if you've ruled out the ignition switch and the clutch switch.

Your only real option at this point is to go here: SpoonerTuner.com - Free downloadable Honda Acura Factory Service Manuals by HELMS and download the electrical guide Kronn posted. That should list every wire in the starter circuit and...sadly...you will just have to check them all one at a time until you find a short or weak connection somewhere.

Typically, an alarm will be wired somewhere into the ignition circuit, I'd start there.

If you want to confirm that it is only a starter related problem try to push start the car. If everything else is still working right, you should be able to push start it and it should run fine. If it won't push start....well then you've got multiple problems.

~GL

Thanks for the reply boss... I dont really have anyone here to help me push start it, so what I DID do is put a jumper wire between the battery and starter and that DID begin to start the motor (didn't leave it on there long enough to see if it would actually turn it over... just wanted to see if it was going to respond at all... perhaps I should leave the lead on ther long enough to see if it would start)

Usually an alarm (according to my reading around here) is tapped into the circuit before the starter relay. I checked all the ignition wires when I tested the ignition switch, there was nothing spliced into it and it was untouched... and tested the switch according to the svc manual and it was working correctly. I've got my HELMS and thats what I've been using so far to try to figure this out but I will definitely take a look at your link as well.

Thanks for all ur suggestions and I'm certainly open to more if u've got any.

ludestarbai · 10-07-2010, 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spin_r_g

What brand of alarm was it?

Very old model clifford... I can't remember exactly but I'm pretty sure its removed correctly... I've looked around for any cut wires and I see nothing under there... the few places the wires looked like they went into the stock harness they were t-tapped in) -- I guess theres a chance that the T-tap went all the way through the wire and screwed it up? I dunno, but I will test it with the multimeter today.

Quote:

Originally Posted by y2kflh

You didn't mention if the car hasn't started since you removed the alarm. If so, 90% of the time an obvious cause to a problem is just that, and it's related. I'd double check all those wires, even look up the colors in a repair manual schematic to see what each one does. Many alarms disable the starter circuit.

The previous owner 'removed' the alarm... the fuse under hood and fuse near the brain for the alarm was removed... I dont know what else he did to 'remove it' beacuse all the hardware is still there... the brain, relay, etc... but it doesn't look like it was connected to anything. Either way the car started and ran just fine when I got it (after he removed it) --- this issue is happening well after that alarm has been 'removed'.

I'm going to try to figure out how to bypass the starter relay and clutch switch today... and hopefully that gets me somewhere.

If not, then I really am outta ideas... only thing to do then is literally test every wire in the entire diagram.

Any suggesions I'd really appreciate it.

ludestarbai · 10-07-2010, 04:30 PM

Well I got it started fellas, I'm not exactly sure where the problem is yet though... I tested the clutch switch and it seemed to be fine, I did this by checking for continuity on the switch.

I tested the starter cut off relay and it seemed to be fine... I did this by putting 12v to the A and B prongs, and when doing so there was continuity through C and D.

I said screw it may as well try bypassing that whole circuit and used a jumper wire to bypass the relay... connecting 'C and D' ports in the fuse box and it fired right up!!!!

So I'm not sure if my issue could have been in the wiring between the clutch switch and starter cut off relay or if I tested the switch or starter cut off relay incorrectly.

But its starting at least...