<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by jpprelude: Good help guys, thanks. Now I am wanting these DC headers, so go get 'em not rice .
I also heard bad responses on the flapper mod. I also like the sound when that opens up (my fake VTEC ).
OK, so DC headers, some new mild cams, and I'll be all the way nice. I might have to stay H23A and have fun until my motor dies.
I was also considering picking up an extra head and send it to Endyn to see what Larry can do with it. Marcucci, aren't you from his area? I hear Billy refer to "Larry" but wasn't sure if they were the same. I'm very impressed by his d and b series work, and have yet to see him speak of the H23A.
This should definitely be FAQ material, but do you think the mods are paying us any attention? They all roll VTEC.
Thanks again everyone
JP </font>
I searched the TOO forum and found one post regarding the H23. He said that they were looking into it, but it was behind the H22. My memory's fuzzy, but I *think* he was referring to the Roller Wave pistons
Have you guys seen the compression ratios people are asking for? Granted, they aren't for Preludes, and maybe aren't for street driven cars, but I saw mention of people wanting to order pistons with 12.8:1 static compression ratios. Damn!
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">You should know better than to listen to Billy : ) You're right, at least, it isn't "ideal" for what he's doing. But it is better than stock, much better in my opinion. But your new downpipe should have fixed the worst part (downpipe and flex). I assume you did a new flex joint, too?
IMHO, the Mugen is by far the best off-the-shelf header for our car (for NA purposes). The DC would have to be next. The Spoon looks nice, but by only replacing the top piece you leave in the crappiest part of the stock system.
If you have the money, go custom (something like Billy's but maybe not as radical). If you don't, I think the DC is the only way to go. You can find them used (occasionally) and the build quality is great. Except for those mild steel welds on the stainless : (
BTW, dude, love your sig. I **** my pants laughing when I saw that the first time. </font>
I figured with my mods the stock header was fine, but with billy itwould be way to lame. As for my custom job it ended up pretty good but it tink the guy could have done a better job with the welds cuz they are starting to crack. Try to convince a Chevy Big Block, 350 hemi cuda, paxton blower,545 cubic inches, live axel, there is no replacement for displacement, nut head to work on my car, something is bound to give. I acually had him custom weld the down pipe to a dc sport header flange, female side, then got him to make a custom pipe to replace the cat, and then weld a female flange (ball joint style) to the tanabe RM Pipe, it a big mess but the out come was pretty good, He could have done a better job but what do you expect from oklahoman's , just waiting till inspection time to see if i pass! i think not!!
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by pter: I searched the TOO forum and found one post regarding the H23. He said that they were looking into it, but it was behind the H22. My memory's fuzzy, but I *think* he was referring to the Roller Wave pistons
Have you guys seen the compression ratios people are asking for? Granted, they aren't for Preludes, and maybe aren't for street driven cars, but I saw mention of people wanting to order pistons with 12.8:1 static compression ratios. Damn!
</font>
I think that was my post on TOO. I was asking about the availability of his supercharger. He said they plumbed it, but it was being the H22A in development. Basically, don't hold your breath. There is a recent post about him saying that rods were available,and RW pistons for the H22A/H23A were being tested.
My boy went from a D16 to a B18C5 and said he likes the d better, so we don't need VTEC. We peak out torquewise 1300 rpms quicker and have like 2 more ft/lbs. Not trying to start a war with VTEC guys.
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by pter: I searched the TOO forum and found one post regarding the H23. He said that they were looking into it, but it was behind the H22. My memory's fuzzy, but I *think* he was referring to the Roller Wave pistons
Have you guys seen the compression ratios people are asking for? Granted, they aren't for Preludes, and maybe aren't for street driven cars, but I saw mention of people wanting to order pistons with 12.8:1 static compression ratios. Damn!
</font>
I think that was my post on TOO. I was asking about the availability of his supercharger. He said they plumbed it, but it was being the H22A in development. Basically, don't hold your breath. There is a recent post about him saying that rods were available,and RW pistons for the H22A/H23A were being tested.
My boy went from a D16 to a B18C5 and said he likes the d better, so we don't need VTEC. We peak out torquewise 1300 rpms quicker and have like 2 more ft/lbs. Not trying to start a war with VTEC guys.
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by jpprelude: - snip -I was also considering picking up an extra head and send it to Endyn to see what Larry can do with it. Marcucci, aren't you from his area? I hear Billy refer to "Larry" but wasn't sure if they were the same. I'm very impressed by his d and b series work, and have yet to see him speak of the H23A.
JP </font>
Yup, we're all in the Dallas/Fort Worth metroplex. I won't speak on Larry/T.O.O./Endyn... Larry is secretive and so are T.O.O. and Endyn : )
My suggestion would be to do your homework. It sounds odd, but pick up a copy of Hot Rod. Go to theoldone.com and read all of Larry (oops, I mean T.O.O.'s) articles from the old Hot Rod and Circle Track magazines. Read that and his H22A head/manifold work, and...
My understanding is that Larry is up to his ass in Honda parts and won't be doing any more for a while. He makes most of his knowledge public, though- just read the articles and info on what he's done already.
thanks marcucci. I've been on there for somewhere around a year now and read ALL the posts. Sometimes its info overload, but I learn more and more. I only have like 10 posts, but I read like a mofo.
I don't want to ask him anything yet until I get a good idea of what I want. I really don't want to bother him.
I heard at least 2 plus years on our SC. It's not that high on the priority list, with good understanding.
If the Endyn SC sounds interesting to you, definitely don't do a head swap. VTEC is disengaged with the SC.
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by pter: not having the oil squirters for you pistons like the H22 have.
I'm sure you can take it up to VTEC range, but I wouldn't know about doing it reliably.
I also wouldn't assume that taking our H23s to higher rpms would mean more power. It be interesting to see though. Maybe I'll try that later this year.</font>
I am going with some gude cams, so yeah... more power is the issue.
I am not just trying to float the valves with the stock valve train... although that may be amusing to see (not really, thats cruel.).
I plan either a gude ecu (8200-8500 redline) or shogun power tuner for the rev limiter. Just all depends on how much I wanna spend, and I will get some fuel control with the tuner also.
I'm gonna do all the obvious require'd headwork, like springs/ retainers/ valves/ valve guides/ valve seats/ etc. etc.
The thing that I am kinda curious about, is the oil squirters that you were talking about??? Why are they so ness.???
The oil squirters are in the H22 block. They're there to cool the pistons for high rpm operation. Why that's necessary, I dunno. Before people were mentioning this, I had never heard of piston squirters, but then again I really don't know all that much
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Luder-xhpx: no one thinks the h23 can take 'vtec' range rpms?
why's that?
I am gonna be turning more than that soon and I don't think the h23 has a long enough stroke to limit it's working rpm range like your saying.
can someone elaborate if possible?</font>
I don't think a Si motor can for very long - safely. It would have to be MUCH stronger than the VTEC motor to handle those kinds of revs with a longer stroke. You'd blow your Si motor real quick if you took it anywhere even remotely close to 8,000+ rpms. Trust me, I know. If you don't believe me - go to atomic performance and check out my Si motor - one of my rods separated from one of my pistons. It's your motor, so do what you want, but don't say I didn't warn you. I didn't even go that much past 7k rpms when it broke. Why do you think b16s can hit over 9k rpms easy - it's because of the short stroke. Millimeters matter.
Also, xHPx, talk to Bill Gude - he'll tell you that there's no way a H23 with a stock bottom end will take 8,000 rpms. As in NO WAY. Sorry, but I just don't want to see you blow your motor. Also, the power will fall off sharply after 7k rpms with Gude cams.
LLL
[This message has been edited by LudesLudesLudes (edited April 12, 2001).]
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LOL!
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